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The App Store turns 10

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Re: The App Store turns 10

#51

Post by noxToken »

scarface74 wrote: post #28
sillyquiet wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This can happen, when non-scrupulous devs 'deprecate' an older version of their app in favor of the 'new' version. e.g., you buy 'CoolApp' and in-app purchase features for it. But oh no, 'CoolApp2' has come out and 'CoolApp' is no longer updated for newer devices, so sorry. Otherwise, an app, and its in-app purchase set remain available via a user's iTunes account indefinitely as far as I can tell.

Why is it "non-scrupulous" for a dev to charge for a new version of piece of software? Are they suppose to update an app forever without further compensation?

Here's a realistic scenario. I pay for CoolApp. It works fine even though CoolApp2 is live on the store. I get a new phone. I go to download CoolApp, but it's no longer available. If I want to use CoolApp, I must use CoolApp2.

I'm not expecting CoolApp to be forever supported. CoolApp works fine for my use case, so I planned on continually using CoolApp until it made sense for me to upgrade. But now that CoolApp2 is the only version available, I have to buy the newer version alongside my new device. If I turn on my old phone, I can still use CoolApp without skipping a beat. I think that's what the other commenter was getting at.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#52

Post by sillyquiet »

s73v3r_ wrote: post #19
sillyquiet wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This can happen, when non-scrupulous devs 'deprecate' an older version of their app in favor of the 'new' version. e.g., you buy 'CoolApp' and in-app purchase features for it. But oh no, 'CoolApp2' has come out and 'CoolApp' is no longer updated for newer devices, so sorry. Otherwise, an app, and its in-app purchase set remain available via a user's iTunes account indefinitely as far as I can tell.

I fail to see how that's unscrupulous, as that's a new version of the app, and that's how software was sold for decades.

I mean, that's a fair point that I completely support, but I was thinking of the cases where the 'new' version has no new features other than a name change.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#53

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

waivek wrote: post #33

Whenever I get a new Windows laptop, the first four or five hours are spent reinstalling software that I use on a daily basis. I can just leave a new phone next to the router. With windows, I have to sit and monitor a lot of things for those four hours along with hunting down the most updated executables and setup files. I feel that mobile got software distribution correct. Thanks a ton, Scott Forstall.

On the one hand, AppStore/Package Management models allow you to do that, on the other hand applications that aren't in the store/repo may as well not exist.

To me, part of what makes PCs "Personal Computers" is that I don't need to go through some third party to distribute or acquire software. I don't need anyone's blessing, and I don't need to jump through hoops rooting the device or compiling from source, I just do it because it's my computer.

If all Windows applications were PortableApps, all you'd have to do when getting a new computer is copy over the directories where your applications are stored. Installs are a copy, uninstalls are a delete.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#54

Post by mankash666 »

duxup wrote: post #42
mankash666 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite initial plans, that ship has long sailed. Apple's all about exerting control over the app store, and purposefully breaking the open web on their platform, to drive users and devs to the app store. Non exhaustive list of web APIs broken on iOS Safari: 1. WebRTC Data channel 2. WebGl 2 3. Limiting WebApp storage to 50MB, just because. Oh, and purging it at random, just because 4. Web push notifications 5. Disal…

Oh I don't doubt it, they're not interested in going back. I just thought it was an interesting fact if true about their perspective early on. Heck I'm just getting into web development and honestly... web apps seem to be JUST barely now getting there when it comes to app quality, polish.

> web apps seem to be JUST barely now getting there when it comes to app quality, polish.

True. And this is the time for Apple to support and reach parity with other browser vendors on emerging Web features. Unless their true intent is to unfairly drive devs and users to the app store,

Re: The App Store turns 10

#55

Post by sillyquiet »

noxToken wrote: post #51
scarface74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it "non-scrupulous" for a dev to charge for a new version of piece of software? Are they suppose to update an app forever without further compensation?

Here's a realistic scenario. I pay for CoolApp. It works fine even though CoolApp2 is live on the store. I get a new phone. I go to download CoolApp, but it's no longer available. If I want to use CoolApp, I must use CoolApp2. I'm not expecting CoolApp to be forever supported. CoolApp works fine for my use case, so I planned on continually using CoolApp until it made sense for me to upgrade. But now that CoolApp2 is…

That's the scenario I was thinking of. I think most of the debate on this thread is my use of 'non-scrupulous' to describe that scenario. Which is fair.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#56

Post by nodamage »

sillyquiet wrote: post #48
nodamage wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, even apps that have been removed from sale by the developer can still be installed by the customer through the previous purchases section of the App Store. (Assuming it's still compatible with the device and version of iOS you're trying to install on.)

Right, I was thinking specifically of a number of apps that were never updated and won't run on newer devices.

Well if an app has been abandoned then it's abandoned and there's nothing anyone can do. But if makers of 'CoolApp' release 'CoolApp2' with support for newer devices then I think that's entirely reasonable to remove the original version and ask users to pay for the upgrade.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#57

Post by duxup »

scarface74 wrote: post #46
duxup wrote: post #31

I heard once that Steve and Co. early on envisioned the iPhone to work mostly with web apps through the browser, but when it became clear the tech wasn't going to be there they went the app store route? Anyone have anything that backs that up or hear the same thing? It's interesting that 10 years later we're still there ;)

It was Apple's official "sweet solution" for app development on the iPhone. https://daringfireball.net/2007/06/wwdc_2007_keynote

Thank you very much. My how things have changed ... and still haven't caught up. Granted as another user says, Apple has no reason to push apps off the store to the web now considering the insane cash flow.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#58

Post by nodamage »

noxToken wrote: post #51
scarface74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it "non-scrupulous" for a dev to charge for a new version of piece of software? Are they suppose to update an app forever without further compensation?

Here's a realistic scenario. I pay for CoolApp. It works fine even though CoolApp2 is live on the store. I get a new phone. I go to download CoolApp, but it's no longer available. If I want to use CoolApp, I must use CoolApp2. I'm not expecting CoolApp to be forever supported. CoolApp works fine for my use case, so I planned on continually using CoolApp until it made sense for me to upgrade. But now that CoolApp2 is…

Except that's not correct. If you've purchased CoolApp you can always re-install it via the previous purchases section of the App Store, even if the developer has removed it from sale. So you can continue using CoolApp as long as it continues to work on your iOS version and device.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#59

Post by sxg »

noxToken wrote: post #51
scarface74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it "non-scrupulous" for a dev to charge for a new version of piece of software? Are they suppose to update an app forever without further compensation?

Here's a realistic scenario. I pay for CoolApp. It works fine even though CoolApp2 is live on the store. I get a new phone. I go to download CoolApp, but it's no longer available. If I want to use CoolApp, I must use CoolApp2. I'm not expecting CoolApp to be forever supported. CoolApp works fine for my use case, so I planned on continually using CoolApp until it made sense for me to upgrade. But now that CoolApp2 is…

But that's not the case (at least not on iOS). Even if CoolApp has been removed from sale, you can download it on your new phone from your purchase history. The only exceptions to this are technical limitations on the old app that render it incompatible with the new phone such as 32 vs 64 bit, deprecated APIs, etc.

Re: The App Store turns 10

#60

Post by scarface74 »

noxToken wrote: post #51
scarface74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it "non-scrupulous" for a dev to charge for a new version of piece of software? Are they suppose to update an app forever without further compensation?

Here's a realistic scenario. I pay for CoolApp. It works fine even though CoolApp2 is live on the store. I get a new phone. I go to download CoolApp, but it's no longer available. If I want to use CoolApp, I must use CoolApp2. I'm not expecting CoolApp to be forever supported. CoolApp works fine for my use case, so I planned on continually using CoolApp until it made sense for me to upgrade. But now that CoolApp2 is…

If CoolApp was a 32 bit app. You wouldn't be able to use it post iOS 10.
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