Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

newyorker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 120 posts

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#41

Post by mrchicity »

confiscate wrote: post #24

Test scores are race-blind and fair. Test instructors do not give more scores to a test because they see it was completed by an Asian test-taker. It's great that schools are looking for a better "mix" of ethnicities in the incoming class, but they should encourage the underrepresented ethnicities to do better, in tests or other race-blind admission standards. They should not put an admission "cap" based on the color…

I agree totally. Tests can be slightly flawed, and rich kids can prep their way to another 50 points, but nothing else in life comes close in terms of fairness. Maybe sports and that's it. There's something noble about that.

Tell me where else a poor farmer's kid from Alabama, a child of refugees who spoke no English at home, someone from an unpopular religion, a kid who grew up in the ghetto without a father, someone from the working class who speaks with a regional accent, etc. etc. can compete on a pretty level playing field with wealthy elites?

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#42

Post by marris »

Yup. It's especially disheartening that most of the discussion centers around "privilege" and the supposed ease of coasting into one of these schools if parents pay for test prep. Anyone can get test prep books from the New York Public library and practice, practice, practice. The fact that so few members from some groups attend the school says far more about the importance of education in their homes than it does about lack of "endowment."

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#43

Post by Fomite »

confiscate wrote: post #24

Test scores are race-blind and fair. Test instructors do not give more scores to a test because they see it was completed by an Asian test-taker. It's great that schools are looking for a better "mix" of ethnicities in the incoming class, but they should encourage the underrepresented ethnicities to do better, in tests or other race-blind admission standards. They should not put an admission "cap" based on the color…

"Test scores are race-blind and fair." This is not axiomatically true.

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#44

Post by gnicholas »

dilap wrote: post #11

Here's another, more critical take on the plan: https://quillette.com/2018/06/27/bill-de-blasios-plan-to-pur... I think it's terrible. It's robbing poor kids of a rare opportunity to get a first-rate education, to make elites feel better about themselves. If you insist that the racial demographics of the schools match those of the city, a much better way to do it is to keep the admissions test, but simply take the to…

> simply take the top N% w/in each racial bucket, rather than globally

This would benefit wealthy Black/Latino kids, whose parents can afford test prep. If the goal is to have a more racially diverse student body, it accomplishes that goal. But if the goal is to help disadvantaged kids get ahead, then it's not useful.

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#45

Post by ralston »

Reactionary_ wrote: post #26

1. I believe black and hispanic students could do just as well as asian students if their cultures were similar to that of the asian students. Let's not kid ourselves. The asian students doing well on these tests are born into cultures that value academic achievement more than the average black or hispanic family. There's nothing inherently different about the different groups aside from their cultures. Keep the test…

Ahhh, I will refuse to pay the troll toll :)

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#46

Post by akhilcacharya »

I don't agree with taking top N% as the only admittance criteria but the constant pearl clutching about this and the Harvard case really bothers me.

The idea that this one school can make or break one's future is either absurd or terrifying, and I'm not sure which is actually true.

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#48

Post by mrchicity »

Fomite wrote: post #43
confiscate wrote: post #24

Test scores are race-blind and fair. Test instructors do not give more scores to a test because they see it was completed by an Asian test-taker. It's great that schools are looking for a better "mix" of ethnicities in the incoming class, but they should encourage the underrepresented ethnicities to do better, in tests or other race-blind admission standards. They should not put an admission "cap" based on the color…

"Test scores are race-blind and fair." This is not axiomatically true.

Why are they unfair? I've heard the old saw about the 1980s SATs asking some analogy with a regatta:yacht, but what bias has been uncovered lately?

And why is this bias mostly helping Asians, a minority group, who more likely to be learning English as a second language?

Re: Why Asian-Americans feel powerless in New York’s elite high schools

#50

Post by iosDrone »

ericdykstra wrote: post #20

The entire doctrine of Disparate Impact, and Affirmative Action which is borne from it, is one of the most illiberal policies in America. I really hope a constitutionalist Supreme Court can reverse this madness. On Affirmative Action in specific, here's a great interview from Sowell about the unintended consequences that arise from the awful policy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVvnTByzTmA

It will be ruled unconstitutional within two years. The way to stop discrimination based on race is to stop discriminating based on race.
Post reply on HN