How to get kids to pay attention • Hacker News Board

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#91

Post by empath75 » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:08 PM UTC

As someone who has spent a bit of time traveling in the Mayan parts of Guatemala and Mexico, it seems difficult to me to compare parenting styles without also considering the fact that quite a few of the Maya in general are living in abject poverty with very little social mobility and with often 3+ generations of family living in close proximity, and I suspect as their financial situation improves and they have better access to distractions like tv or internet, the differences will fade away. I’d be very surprised if it even survived one generation of living in Guatemala City, let alone after moving to the US.

It’s one thing to let your kids free roam in a village that has a single dirt road going through it and almost everyone around you is a cousin or has known your family for generations. It’s quite another in the suburbs where you have only had a 5 minute chat with one neighbor in 3 months.

I’m also sort of skeptical of applying a value judgement to one or the other — I’m not sure that it would be beneficial to raise your kids that way in the developed world, although it sounds nice in the abstract.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#92

Post by nickserv » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:10 PM UTC

colecut wrote: post #45

wolco wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Raising a child and being liked are two different agendas and at times are at odds. Best advice don't be your child's friend be parent plenty of peers who can be friends but none that can be parents.

I have an 8 year old son, and I think I do a pretty good job of being stern / enforcing rules while also ensuring him that he is liked and loved.. There is definitely a balance in there, "not being his friend" I think is too far to one side... I just don't let being his friend prevent me from holding him to a certain expectation.

To me, a friend is an equal, and someone you can count on. My sons are not my equals, and I'm not their friend. This doesn't mean I don't show love or affection, just that I don't expect the same kind of support from them as I do my friends. I also don't order my friends around from time to time ;-)

However I hope in the future we be friends, when I don't need to wipe their ass or provide food and shelter.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#93

Post by TomMarius » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:12 PM UTC

Kluny wrote: post #36

maltalex wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I often wonder what civilization would be like if adults asked the same question to themselves and then lead a life where they focused on that instead of being pressured into "making a living". I imagine we'd have an abundance of pilots, and actors and a severe lack of toilet cleaners.

Personally I think there are more people than you think who would be perfectly happy to clean toilets as their contribution, so long as they were compensated fairly for it.

That would mean raising prices, and thus the toilet cleaner him/herself wouldn't be able to buy the things that you want them to reach anyways.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#94

Post by empath75 » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:12 PM UTC

qznc wrote: post #70

So it comes down to the choice of the kids. Apparently, making an origami jumping mouse is interesting for mayan kids, but not for american ones. The article doesn't even try to convince me that autonomy is the critical factor. When a professor starts a sentence with "It may be the case that" it is clearly just personal opinion and not published scientific fact. The professor intentionally makes the disclaimer that s…

Yeah the reason is that they can’t afford to buy talking Paw patrol toys.

I’ve handed a bunch of Mayan kids my iPad and they didn’t give it back to me for hours. They totally forgot their beautiful handmade toys in an instant.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#95

Post by herrokan » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:13 PM UTC

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #82

tqkxzugoaupvwqr wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salary of cleaners would rise until enough people are willing to do the job or it is more profitable to install self-cleaning toilets.

Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages, Is there something a pilot needs to live comfortably that somehow a cleaner doesn't?

>Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages

supply and demand

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#96

Post by AndrewKemendo » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:14 PM UTC

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #82

tqkxzugoaupvwqr wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salary of cleaners would rise until enough people are willing to do the job or it is more profitable to install self-cleaning toilets.

Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages, Is there something a pilot needs to live comfortably that somehow a cleaner doesn't?

Here's a pretty good introduction to how labor pricing works:

https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-economics/chapte...

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#97

Post by herrokan » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:15 PM UTC

oblio wrote: post #41

hutzlibu wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"and a severe lack of toilet cleaners." not a problem because we probably would have selfcleaning toilets by then by default.

Toilets built by the underemployed pilots and actors? :)

You know not everyone is interested in becoming a pilot or an actor, right?

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#98

Post by colecut » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:19 PM UTC

nickserv wrote: post #92

colecut wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an 8 year old son, and I think I do a pretty good job of being stern / enforcing rules while also ensuring him that he is liked and loved.. There is definitely a balance in there, "not being his friend" I think is too far to one side... I just don't let being his friend prevent me from holding him to a certain expectation.

To me, a friend is an equal, and someone you can count on. My sons are not my equals, and I'm not their friend. This doesn't mean I don't show love or affection, just that I don't expect the same kind of support from them as I do my friends. I also don't order my friends around from time to time ;-) However I hope in the future we be friends, when I don't need to wipe their ass or provide food and shelter.

I would agree on the wiping ass part, it's hard to be friends until then.. but I have a 40 year old brother who still barely provides his own food and shelter so good luck with that part =)

I think of "friend" as someone you enjoy spending free time with and are willing/open to confiding in

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#99

Post by pbhjpbhj » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:25 PM UTC

MrStonedOne wrote: post #86

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages, Is there something a pilot needs to live comfortably that somehow a cleaner doesn't?

The confusion here is because you are mixing up "wage", "a living", and "lifestyle cost". Wage is compensation for labor and follows all of the normal market rules of supply and demand. A living relates to the amount of money needed to pay for them to live. Rent, food, etc. "lifestyle cost" is the above plus non-necessities. Wage has zero relation to a living, and lifestyle cost. Your wage doesn't go up just because…

Hmm, so minimum wages don't exist and when the cost of living rises wages never adapt to accommodate it. I think these concepts are far more linked than you suggest.

>Wage is compensation for labor and follows all of the normal market rules of supply and demand. //

It only follows those rules because those able to influence it have brought in that regime -- USA has been wetting its corporate pants over the idea that the hierarchy of wages might be broken by communism for some time. (Not to say communism is good, just it amuses me how they had to demonise communists - coming over here with their egalitarianism, trying to treat everyone as a person, embodying the maxim of 'being created equal' - in order to maintain capitalism and keep the peons/proles in their place. I digress.

Wages can reflect a person's worth to the owners of a company (they're worth X, because they bring us X+Y leading to profit) ...

OR they can reflect that people are "equal before God" and that one person's time is worth the same as another.

But, my time is worth more than their's -- well great, you can benefit society all the more.

But, no-one will work unless you use greed, selfishness, subjugation of others to motivate them ... well let's just keep mass murdering each other every 50 years or so we can keep the corporate masters in the style they're accustomed too.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#100

Post by Swizec » Sun, Jul 01, 2018, 7:25 PM UTC

mos_basik wrote: post #87

lgregg wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can relate, I was born/grew up overseas and was raised this way before my parents moved back to the states. I moved back with them, and it was surprising how little my friends had in life skills. I had learned to cook (from watching/learning) already and would cook for myself after school for example, while most of my friends would have zero ideas on what to do. It's sad how the U.S. Government prevents native Amer…

>There's a cultural vibe of individualism [where?] preventing overwatch of kids [whose kids?] by adults which has led, in part, to the prohibitive [prohibiting what?] autonomy that I had as a kid. I don't quite understand what you're saying here, but I'm genuinely interested. Could you clarify? Active listening: What I thought you said is that in, say, the Philippines, there is a culture of individualism that prevent…

My interpreta is that in many other countries there is a sense of collectivism in that everyone takes care of children and collaborates a little bit. If you see a kid, you don’t think something must be wrong, you lend assistance to their parents by being an impromptu guardian and help the kid achieve their means.

Whereas in the US the modus operandi is “Well it’s not my kid what do I care? Their parents must be terrible people for not standing right next to them”

For example, as a 7 year old in eastern-ish europe, I would walk 1km to school on my own every morning. The worst that ever happened was when me and a friend decided that umbrellas arr the perfect snow shovel.