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How to get kids to pay attention

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Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#81

Post by jpalomaki »

tonyarkles wrote: post #18
maltalex wrote: post #4

> For starters, he says, ask your kid this question: 'What would you do if you didn't have to do anything else?' In the western world the answer to that question is often some addictive activity such as playing video games, or watching videos on youtube.

> In the western world the answer to that question is often some addictive activity such as playing video games, watching videos on youtube or something similar. I was a relatively free-range child. I had a bike, I had a pocket full of quarters to call home if I needed to, and if I wanted to I could stay home and play video games (we had an NES, followed by a SNES, but not that many games). What did I do? I rode my b…

Maybe it was different back then. Most games were simpler and many of us did not have endless collection of games. It was much easier to get bored playing with computer. Now the app stores are filled with free, addictive stuff. And that’s just games.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#82

Post by pbhjpbhj »

tqkxzugoaupvwqr wrote: post #37
maltalex wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I often wonder what civilization would be like if adults asked the same question to themselves and then lead a life where they focused on that instead of being pressured into "making a living". I imagine we'd have an abundance of pilots, and actors and a severe lack of toilet cleaners.

The salary of cleaners would rise until enough people are willing to do the job or it is more profitable to install self-cleaning toilets.

Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages, Is there something a pilot needs to live comfortably that somehow a cleaner doesn't?

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#83

Post by nickjj »

mhb wrote: post #47
nickjj wrote: post #5

What's really interesting to me is this same thing can be applied to adults too. The article writes: > For starters, he says, ask your kid this question: 'What would you do if you didn't have to do anything else?' I often wonder what civilization would be like if adults asked the same question to themselves and then lead a life where they focused on that instead of being pressured into "making a living".

Is this really so hard to figure out? Very few people would do things which are useful to keep civilization running if they have a choice. Look at what people do with their leisure time - watch commercial TV, play video games, look at nonsense on Facebook. It wouldn't be pretty.

I don't think it would be as bad as you think.

If you wanted to remain living in your ideal world, you would make adjustments to your life for the sole purpose of maintaining your lifestyle instead of just thinking "meh, someone else will do it".

I have to think if this were built into how we lived for hundreds of generations, then your mindset would even change from "maintaining my lifestyle" to "this is what we do to keep everyone happy".

I'm not a hardcore socialist either. I'm almost the opposite. I like the idea that if someone puts in a lot of effort, they should have a lot of success. I have no sympathy for people who want to just watch TV and expect to be carried by society. But, at the same time, I would much rather live in a world where everyone was happy doing what they love, and everything just worked out without the concept of money.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#84

Post by koolba »

tomohawk wrote: post #43

This is pretty much how I was raised in a small midwestern farming community. I was in charge of the laundry by the time I was 6, and the lawn when I was 8 or 9, and summers were pretty much filled with activities that my friends and I could organize. Moving to the burbs where play was organized sports and kids had everything done for them was a really big shock. It was hard to believe how inept at life most of my pe…

People naturally rise to their responsibilities, whether it’s work or basic life skills. Like learning a language, it come more naturally to children as there’s to no second guessing the difficulty of the undertaking nor the fear of failing at a task.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#85

Post by lgregg »

microcolonel wrote: post #77
lgregg wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can relate, I was born/grew up overseas and was raised this way before my parents moved back to the states. I moved back with them, and it was surprising how little my friends had in life skills. I had learned to cook (from watching/learning) already and would cook for myself after school for example, while most of my friends would have zero ideas on what to do. It's sad how the U.S. Government prevents native Amer…

Not really sure about your terms here, you seem to be glorifying individualism in practice, but blaming it in name? What could be more individualistic than doing something on your own?

I disagree, I'm glorifying autonomy in relation to self-determination theory but critiquing individualism as a cultural ideology or orientation. I used different words because I wasn't expecting a response like yours.

If you want a deep dive, this is a good paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12518973

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#86

Post by MrStonedOne »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #82
tqkxzugoaupvwqr wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The salary of cleaners would rise until enough people are willing to do the job or it is more profitable to install self-cleaning toilets.

Why do pilots and cleaners need different wages, Is there something a pilot needs to live comfortably that somehow a cleaner doesn't?

The confusion here is because you are mixing up "wage", "a living", and "lifestyle cost".

Wage is compensation for labor and follows all of the normal market rules of supply and demand.

A living relates to the amount of money needed to pay for them to live. Rent, food, etc.

"lifestyle cost" is the above plus non-necessities.

Wage has zero relation to a living, and lifestyle cost. Your wage doesn't go up just because you want to spend more money at brothels in nevada, and it doesn't go down just because you stopped needing to spend as much money on food because you got a costco membership.

Or to put it simply, the rate of your labor has zero relation to your wants and needs.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#87

Post by mos_basik »

lgregg wrote: post #61
tomohawk wrote: post #43

This is pretty much how I was raised in a small midwestern farming community. I was in charge of the laundry by the time I was 6, and the lawn when I was 8 or 9, and summers were pretty much filled with activities that my friends and I could organize. Moving to the burbs where play was organized sports and kids had everything done for them was a really big shock. It was hard to believe how inept at life most of my pe…

I can relate, I was born/grew up overseas and was raised this way before my parents moved back to the states. I moved back with them, and it was surprising how little my friends had in life skills. I had learned to cook (from watching/learning) already and would cook for myself after school for example, while most of my friends would have zero ideas on what to do. It's sad how the U.S. Government prevents native Amer…

>There's a cultural vibe of individualism [where?] preventing overwatch of kids [whose kids?] by adults which has led, in part, to the prohibitive [prohibiting what?] autonomy that I had as a kid.

I don't quite understand what you're saying here, but I'm genuinely interested. Could you clarify?

Active listening: What I thought you said is that in, say, the Philippines, there is a culture of individualism that prevents adults from hovering over kids (not sure how that follows), which leads to the kids having significantly more autonomy than in the U.S. (and maybe you used the word "prohibitive" incorrectly?).

I was also raised by American parents in a village in equatorial Congo--thus my interest.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#88

Post by ebikelaw »

mmt wrote: post #66

I'm disappointed to see this article trot out the "unsafe" trope, especially after, earlier in the article, citing the Maya mother stating her child knows how to avoid traffic. > Now, many parents in the U.S. can't go full-on Maya to motivate kids. It's often not practical — or safe — to give kids that much autonomy in many places, for instance. I'm not asserting that traffic is the only US safety concern (or that it…

Traffic safety is the main reason that US kids aren't out there playing. Because we're "rich" we've created a car-choked hellscape where nobody can be outside. We're so much more "rich" than those backwards people who have to walk to the store or ride a filthy bus.

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#89

Post by MrStonedOne »

Filligree wrote: post #7
nickjj wrote: post #5

What's really interesting to me is this same thing can be applied to adults too. The article writes: > For starters, he says, ask your kid this question: 'What would you do if you didn't have to do anything else?' I often wonder what civilization would be like if adults asked the same question to themselves and then lead a life where they focused on that instead of being pressured into "making a living".

>I often wonder what civilization would be like if adults asked the same question to themselves and then lead a life where they focused on that instead of being pressured into "making a living". Shorter. As much as I'd love to follow my heart, I also know that the things I find personally interesting aren't the same ones I'm good at. Alas, it's also in a field where only the very best make any money at all.

There was this old zenn diagram of the four factors to life that comes to mind.

https://i.imgur.com/i52vIDj.jpg

Re: How to get kids to pay attention

#90

Post by technofiend »

tomohawk wrote: post #43

This is pretty much how I was raised in a small midwestern farming community. I was in charge of the laundry by the time I was 6, and the lawn when I was 8 or 9, and summers were pretty much filled with activities that my friends and I could organize. Moving to the burbs where play was organized sports and kids had everything done for them was a really big shock. It was hard to believe how inept at life most of my pe…

This is meant as parody of course but your comment reminded me of South Park's portrayal of that method: https://youtu.be/MBEfHZITrgo

As someone who grew up with zero structure and seeing my wife who came from a very strict background I hope if we ever do have kids we'll land in the middle somewhere.

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