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'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

theguardian.com

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Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#91

Post by workinthehead »

untog wrote: post #41
ponzored wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just sign up for a degree at a degree mill and you'll get a student visa and an easy route to permanent residency. New Zealand (and Australia) don't care about quality migrants, just quantity, to keep up demand for housing (both countries have housing-bubble-based economies) and to add extra consumption to national GDP. The migrants they really want are Indians who can put downwards pressure on wages. Go to Auckland,…

Irrespective of anything else, I had to laugh at the description of one of the most beautiful places in the planet as the "ass-end of the world".

Why? Asses can be beautiful. And it doesn't change the fact that NZ is about as remote as you can get.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#92

Post by toomanybeersies »

oblio wrote: post #86
toomanybeersies wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a population density problem but a housing supply problem. There just simply aren't enough houses in NZ. Simply finding somewhere to live can be a struggle, let alone somewhere affordable.

So it's artificial scarcity, basically. Someone/something is blocking development, right?

It's a series of problems that confound each other, some artificial, some organic.

First, we have geography. Auckland is located on an isthmus that ranges from 1 km wide to 10 km wide. It's basically on an island. It's also covered in volcanoes. Wellington is bound by the sea on one side, and hills on the other. It's wedged in the middle. They can, and have, expanded into the sea using land reclamation, but there's only so much of that you can do. There's only so much land you can put buildings on, which is a major problem when growing.

NZ also suffers from NIMBYism. People in NZ don't want to live next door to apartments, and they also don't really want to live in apartments either. Everyone wants to live in a detached house with a back yard. This problem is particularly prevalent in Auckland. The poor state of public transport and congestion on the roads in Auckland also limits how far out you can live if you work in the CBD.

And lastly, the rate of immigration has been so high that they just can't build houses or infrastructure fast enough to keep up.

So these 3 factors have worked together to cause a severe housing shortage in Wellington and Auckland in particular.

Christchurch is the only city where house prices and rents are stable or decreasing. However, the city suffered a major earthquake in 2011 which knocked out a lot of the housing supply. Whole suburbs were razed, and will never be built on again. A lot of houses only needed remedial work, rather than full reconstructions, so the housing supply has bounced back reasonably quickly. Christchurch is also the only city of the 3 main cities in NZ that is built on flat plains. Christchurch has practically unlimited space to grow inland.

Most immigrants move to Auckland though, so Auckland has borne the brunt of this housing crisis.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#93

Post by workinthehead »

jpmoral wrote: post #64
ponzored wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In New Zealand and Australia Indian and Chinese workers are essentially seen as replaceable due to the huge numbers of them migrating to both countries (those countries make up the #1 and #2 sources of migrants respectively). The whole point of the migration schemes are to get workers for cheap and to put downwards pressure on wages. A very high skill level is not really required, and big companies will just throw bo…

Can you explain why the government would want to depress wages?

Perhaps under some misguided assumption that it benefits business?

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#94

Post by dingaling »

ponzored wrote: post #28
madaxe_again wrote: post #9

They have a really odd way to attract tech talent.... I exited my startup in the uk two years ago, successfully, leaving a successful and growing technology business behind. I have several ideas which I am prepared to self-fund up to £0.5M, and want a good environment in which to start a new business. I know coders in NZ, and they’re a talented bunch, we began to hatch a plan. In short, the NZ gov’t don’t want it. Th…

Just sign up for a degree at a degree mill and you'll get a student visa and an easy route to permanent residency. New Zealand (and Australia) don't care about quality migrants, just quantity, to keep up demand for housing (both countries have housing-bubble-based economies) and to add extra consumption to national GDP. The migrants they really want are Indians who can put downwards pressure on wages. Go to Auckland,…

> Just sign up for a degree at a degree mill

That's the advice I was given when looking at NZ. At the time I had about 15 years experience in IT but that couldn't be considered as I didn't have a relevant degree.

"Do night classes for a couple of years and get a degree"

Instead I decided to forget about NZ even as a tourist.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#95

Post by hackerman12345 »

peterburkimsher wrote: post #89
hackerman12345 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mentioning your citizenship might help, certain countries look for certain groups (e.g. they have a satellite team in ___ where you speak the language, bonus!).

It's really complicated to explain where I'm from. My passport is British. I was born in Switzerland. My parents live in France. (My dad worked at CERN, if you've been to Geneva you'll understand). I went to university in the UK, exchange programme in Santa Barbara. I did summer jobs in LA, Switzerland, Taipei, Vancouver, Auckland, Korea, China, and India. I decided I like NZ and Canada the most. I need 3 years prior…

That's rough!

Why wouldn't your kids would get your wife's citizenship in most countries? Also your (future?) wife's country probably has marriage visas and what not.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#96

Post by ponzored »

jpmoral wrote: post #64
ponzored wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In New Zealand and Australia Indian and Chinese workers are essentially seen as replaceable due to the huge numbers of them migrating to both countries (those countries make up the #1 and #2 sources of migrants respectively). The whole point of the migration schemes are to get workers for cheap and to put downwards pressure on wages. A very high skill level is not really required, and big companies will just throw bo…

Can you explain why the government would want to depress wages?

Because their big business mates bribe them into doing it. However, Australia is not a corrupt country, so the 'bribe' will mean a high-paid consulting or executive job after their career in politics.

Additionally most of the wages being depressed are actually for entry-level jobs, and the poor have no voice in most democracies since they are not effectively organised.

Its a common scam to get a student visa (often with fake English test results etc) which allows you to enter the country and work 20 hours a week, then to actually work 60 hours and have the boss pay you for 20. This results in payments 1/3rd the level of minimum wage, but this is still attractive enough for poor Indian males to want to come and do it in the hundreds of thousands.

Plus Australia is has very generous welfare for the elderly (aka pensions) and a sub-replacement fertility level, so there is always pressure to maintain that ponzi scheme with more taxable bodies.

Oh, and in addition to all that, the people that are opposing this type of mass immigration are being called racist.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#97

Post by ponzored »

te_chris wrote: post #71
ponzored wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just sign up for a degree at a degree mill and you'll get a student visa and an easy route to permanent residency. New Zealand (and Australia) don't care about quality migrants, just quantity, to keep up demand for housing (both countries have housing-bubble-based economies) and to add extra consumption to national GDP. The migrants they really want are Indians who can put downwards pressure on wages. Go to Auckland,…

There is no way I would choose living in Poland over NZ. Unless you like breathing coal smoke. I actually quite like Poland too, but it isn't even a choice. Also 'basically an Asian city' sounds, basically, racist.

Have you travelled to a city in India? Not exactly a pleasant experience, particularly if you are female.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#98

Post by peterburkimsher »

hackerman12345 wrote: post #95
peterburkimsher wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really complicated to explain where I'm from. My passport is British. I was born in Switzerland. My parents live in France. (My dad worked at CERN, if you've been to Geneva you'll understand). I went to university in the UK, exchange programme in Santa Barbara. I did summer jobs in LA, Switzerland, Taipei, Vancouver, Auckland, Korea, China, and India. I decided I like NZ and Canada the most. I need 3 years prior…

That's rough! Why wouldn't your kids would get your wife's citizenship in most countries? Also your (future?) wife's country probably has marriage visas and what not.

My girlfriend is Taiwanese. Yes, kids could be Taiwanese, but I can't. Taiwan doesn't allow dual citizenship, and also has conscription (I'm a conscientious objector).

I know a mother and son from church here. She went to NYC, met a Chinese man, got married, had a kid. Moved to Canada. He went on a business trip and cheated, they divorced. Without him, she lost her Canadian residency. The kid had 4 passports (US, Canada, China, Taiwan - dual citizenship is allowed under 18) but he couldn't live with his mum unless they moved to Taiwan.

Aged 15, all his education in English, suddenly expected to study at a local Taiwanese school. Last I knew they were trying to move to Germany.

Taiwanese (and Canadian) permanent residency aren't permanent, because if I leave for more than a couple of years I lose it. NZ PR is permanent. (Or 4 years to Canadian citizenship).

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#99

Post by madaxe_again »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #92
oblio wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So it's artificial scarcity, basically. Someone/something is blocking development, right?

It's a series of problems that confound each other, some artificial, some organic. First, we have geography. Auckland is located on an isthmus that ranges from 1 km wide to 10 km wide. It's basically on an island. It's also covered in volcanoes. Wellington is bound by the sea on one side, and hills on the other. It's wedged in the middle. They can, and have, expanded into the sea using land reclamation, but there's o…

Christchurch was where I was looking at starting the business, having visited all of NZ’s major and most of the minor towns and cities - but it seems it’s not really a factor in their decision-making process.

Re: 'New Zealand wants you': the problem with tech at the edge of the world

#100

Post by sjg007 »

peterburkimsher wrote: post #89
hackerman12345 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mentioning your citizenship might help, certain countries look for certain groups (e.g. they have a satellite team in ___ where you speak the language, bonus!).

It's really complicated to explain where I'm from. My passport is British. I was born in Switzerland. My parents live in France. (My dad worked at CERN, if you've been to Geneva you'll understand). I went to university in the UK, exchange programme in Santa Barbara. I did summer jobs in LA, Switzerland, Taipei, Vancouver, Auckland, Korea, China, and India. I decided I like NZ and Canada the most. I need 3 years prior…

As a UK citizen you should be able to work in NZ for up to 23 months if you are aged <=30 on a working holiday visa. You might be able to find a temp job that way and transition to permanent.
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