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Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#131

Post by paulie_a »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #73

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

While you are referring to a different country...since I was a teenager I basically don't pay attention to laws. I would not go out of my way to break them but I personally don't care if I do. I probably broke three laws since midnight...whoopty Doo.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#132

Post by exogeny »

ttul wrote: post #118
exogeny wrote: post #111

I despise getting involved in threads like this, because they always descend into whataboutism ("Oh, but alcohol is worse!, etc.), but here we go with my anecdotal evidence. Me, personally, not a huge fan. I dabbled and experimented like a good chunk of Americans, decided it wasn't for me. Not necessarily because I didn't enjoy it - although I was involved in quite a bit of team sports at the time and was worried abo…

It’s not about whether using cannabis is a good idea. It’s about whether having it be a severe criminal offense is a good way to discourage use. That approach quite obviously hasn’t worked, and has resulted in various serious externalities such as criminal enterprises.

Can't disagree with that. I sort of feel like there's a middle ground between the two, but if I had to pick one, this is the correct solution.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#133

Post by exogeny »

webkike wrote: post #113
exogeny wrote: post #111

I despise getting involved in threads like this, because they always descend into whataboutism ("Oh, but alcohol is worse!, etc.), but here we go with my anecdotal evidence. Me, personally, not a huge fan. I dabbled and experimented like a good chunk of Americans, decided it wasn't for me. Not necessarily because I didn't enjoy it - although I was involved in quite a bit of team sports at the time and was worried abo…

I guess putting thousands of minorities in jail is worth it because your friends didn't start venture capital funds

I think you're most likely smart enough to know that wasn't the point I was making, and most likely have enough interests in your life not to waste your own time being a pedantic, obtuse dick to strangers on HN.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#134

Post by DesiLurker »

rubatuga wrote: post #86
gschier wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's essentially "legal" in Canada already so no one really cares about it that much.

Exactly, the legality is almost a nonissue at this point, we have already reached a saturation of news regarding legalization.

purely from financial PoV I'd say legality is a big issue because now these firms can get easy financing and eventually raise money by listing in major exchanges. overall I feel pretty good about it.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#135

Post by foolfoolz »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #73

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs, such as heroin or methamphetamine, which are so harmful and addictive that nobody should be using them, or GHB, where the potential for fatal overdose is so high.

I dont understand this part. The potential for overdose on alcohol is high as well. I can go buy a plastic handle for $10 and if i drink the whole thing tonight i'll probably die. I think the right path is full legalization similar to OTC medicine in the US. You have FDA verification you are actually taking what you think you're taking, no weird fentanyl substitutes or cuttings. You put warning labels on describing dosages and limits. You let people use them and get treatment if they abuse it. It's the same way we treat alcohol, just we are conditioned to think alcohol is somehow way more safe than something like heroin.

There are responsible drinkers and responsible heroin users out there. I know it may sound scary but I don't think there's a major inherent harm to having methamphetamine available over the counter. Some people will abuse it. Some people are already abusing it.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#136

Post by ben_w »

malnourish wrote: post #124
wiradikusuma wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But would it be the gateway to heavier, and illegal/dangerous, drugs?

Everyone who's tried meth has drank water.

While true, that’s not going to convince anyone. A better argument, from what I’ve heard, is that the real “gateway drug” is underage smoking.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#137

Post by y4mi »

foolfoolz wrote: post #135
toomanybeersies wrote: post #73

Meanwhile in Britain, the former leader of the Conservative Party, William Hague, spoke out and claimed that the war on cannabis had been "irreversibly lost". He was quickly shut down by Theresa May, who categorically ruled out legalisation or even decriminalisation [1]. I don't understand how politicians can stand up and claim that legalisation would have substantial negatives, when every experiment with legalisatio…

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs, such as heroin or methamphetamine, which are so harmful and addictive that nobody should be using them, or GHB, where the potential for fatal overdose is so high. I dont understand this part. The potential for overdose on alcohol is high as well. I can go buy a plastic handle for $10 and if i drink the whole thing tonight i'll probably di…

its way easier to overdose on hard drugs than alcohol.

with alcohol, its a slow progress. you keep drinkng and most people pass out / lose their will to drink after they've had enough.

hard drugs are generally a single portion and once its in your blood, its too late. you cant say 'hey, i've got enough for today' once you feel it hitting you. You're already doomed if you've chosen the wrong dosage from the start.

> There are responsible drinkers and responsible heroin users out there

I cant say i've ever heard of anyone ever using heroine responsibly. I'd have to take your word for it, but thats hard, considering how brutal the effects of heroine are on their users.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#138

Post by foolfoolz »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #128
b6 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs It's not obvious to me. The fundamental question is, does an individual own their own body? If the answer is yes, then don't try to restrict what I can do with it so long as I don't harm anyone else. If the answer is no, well, then we need to firm up exactly what the arrangement is supposed to be.

I guess it depends on your philosophy of government and society. If you live in a social democracy with universal healthcare, drugs policy should probably be based around harm reduction. This is why helmets are required on bicycles (in some countries, for better or worse) and you need to wear a seatbelt in the car. It's your body, but the public has to pick up the tab when you break it. I don't think that you should…

I think this is a slippery slope. Drug legalization shouldn't be about reducing harm to optimize cost effective economics of keeping people alive. If that were true then you would have the power to outlaw anything that isn't healthy in the name of saving public tax dollars. Cigarettes. Soda. Deep fried foods. Watching too much TV. Sky diving. etc.

Drug legalization is about using public funds on other issues besides individual drug users, reducing prison populations for non-violent drug offenders, offering those in need treatment instead of incarceration, removing an income stream for gangs

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#139

Post by c22 »

y4mi wrote: post #137
foolfoolz wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs, such as heroin or methamphetamine, which are so harmful and addictive that nobody should be using them, or GHB, where the potential for fatal overdose is so high. I dont understand this part. The potential for overdose on alcohol is high as well. I can go buy a plastic handle for $10 and if i drink the whole thing tonight i'll probably di…

its way easier to overdose on hard drugs than alcohol. with alcohol, its a slow progress. you keep drinkng and most people pass out / lose their will to drink after they've had enough. hard drugs are generally a single portion and once its in your blood, its too late. you cant say 'hey, i've got enough for today' once you feel it hitting you. You're already doomed if you've chosen the wrong dosage from the start. > T…

On the other hand, even if you don't die right away alcohol's no slouch in the finding ways to kill you and ruining lives department.

Re: Canada legalises recreational cannabis use

#140

Post by foolfoolz »

y4mi wrote: post #137
foolfoolz wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Obviously we want to restrict access as much as possible to particular drugs, such as heroin or methamphetamine, which are so harmful and addictive that nobody should be using them, or GHB, where the potential for fatal overdose is so high. I dont understand this part. The potential for overdose on alcohol is high as well. I can go buy a plastic handle for $10 and if i drink the whole thing tonight i'll probably di…

its way easier to overdose on hard drugs than alcohol. with alcohol, its a slow progress. you keep drinkng and most people pass out / lose their will to drink after they've had enough. hard drugs are generally a single portion and once its in your blood, its too late. you cant say 'hey, i've got enough for today' once you feel it hitting you. You're already doomed if you've chosen the wrong dosage from the start. > T…

I think a lot of this can be attributed to these drugs being used in a completely ad hoc manner. There's no usage guidelines on a bag of cocaine. There's no 'Active Ingredient' percentage listed. You dont know what it is. You can't compare it to another until you've had it. Any pill that's an upper is called 'molly'

Somehow the vast majority of people who take legal hard drugs such as vicodin or dilaudid, don't overdose on them. There's a culture built around taking these drugs responsibly according to their directions. We have that very strongly ingrained in our culture about alcohol. I think that same culture would develop if your cocaine came in a box from CVS with proper instructions on when you can take it and what side effects to look for.

Of course people are going to make mistakes. They are going to abuse drugs. But that is happening today. Trying to solve that by keeping the drugs away sounds like the same policies in the war on drugs that we are saying aren't working and leading to legalization

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