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Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

independent.co.uk

71–80 of 240 posts

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#71
post #66

The possibilities for psychedelic drugs to treat and shed insight into mental health issues are exciting. But I think it's worth pointing out (especially if you are a recreational user or are considering it) that we don't understand the side effects very well. Low resolution, we know they don't kill you or lead to addiction (though they can cause problems in people with underlying mental health problems). But I'm con…

The risk of HPPD seems to be very related to frequency of use, dosage, how strongly the substance binds to the receptor, and the anxiety levels of the person taking it.

It's a risk that should be taken very seriously, but if you're just taking a low dose of mushrooms once a year or so it's not a huge risk.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#72
post #60
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The general consensus is that this is an extremely small portion of the population, and that psychedelic use is only typically a premature trigger for a preexisting condition rather than a prime cause for these types of mental issues.

> The general consensus is Your consensus might be general among irresponsible psychonauts that are either lucky or accept psychosis. http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/28/why-were-early-psychede... The general consensus is to use psychedelics only as part of a therapy under supervision of a medical expert. https://www.livescience.com/16287-mushrooms-alter-personalit... > an extremely small portion of the population h…

> Your consensus is only general among irresponsible psychonauts that were lucky enough in the past.

You're using the words "irresponsible" and "lucky" here to trigger an emotional response that these kinds of risks are anything but rare, which simply isn't supported by any data. I "irresponsibly" crossed the street today. Am I "lucky" I wasn't run over by a bus?

> The general consensus is to use psychedelics only as part of a therapy under supervision by a medical expert.

And the general consensus is to always consult your doctor before beginning any kind of exercise program. This is a standard CYA position adopted by the medical profession.

> https://www.nami.org/Learn-More/Mental-Health-By-the-Numbers

Nobody is denying that mental health problems are real and prevalent. The link between psychedelics and the onset mental health problems is what's at issue. 15%–20% of the US population tries psychedelics in their lifetime, and 5% of US adults experience a serious mental illness each year. Mental illness is clearly a huge problem with or without psychedelics, and the zeitgeist of research into these substances in the past decade has been almost universally uncovering the ways they can be used to help the situation.

> How does this reduce the danger of psychedelics in any way ? It increases the danger because you do not know in advance if the drug will trigger your mental disorder that you do not have yet.

Many people have the underlying structural changes in their brain that indicate an imminent onset of symptoms of schizophrenia. In cases like this, it's theorized (but again, data is scant) that psychedelics like LSD can be a triggering event that brings about an onset of symptoms, but ones that were all but inevitable anyway. That's not to say that the loss of even a month or week of sanity isn't tragic, but I've seen very little in the way of evidence that occasional LSD use in particular is substantially more risky for the average mentally healthy person than any other recreational activity one might engage in.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#73

This is wildly speculative, as expected. Some mice grew dendrites. That doesn't mean anything about humans and doesn't come close to meaning anything about depression. It's not that simple.

I don't think the claim is 'it's that simple', but rather 'this warrants more research into the subject'. As usual. But that's not a bad thing.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#74
post #15

I’m really worried about the subset of the population with preexisting mental disorders such as manic depressive disorder, schizophrenia, and depression who will suffer a psychotic break from the use of these substances. Maybe I’m wrong, but from what I’ve heard and read it seems like there’s no way to know what will happen until you try it. A certain percentage of the population goes to hell in the most literal sens…

"I’m really worried about the subset of the population with preexisting mental disorders such as manic depressive disorder, schizophrenia, and depression who will suffer a psychotic break from the use of these substances." Psychedelics have been used to treat schizophrenia and depression before. Here is an excerpt from a paper on "Treatment of Childhood Schizophrenia Utilizing LSD and Psilocybin" [1]: The first patie…

> She was a very intelligent girl, perhaps an ancient soul.

The author suffers from psychosis.

Many people accept psychosis as normal.

PS: Removed the word "religion" to prevent a religious flamewar.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#75
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also takes a lot of commitment and time that not everyone has, and requires you to by physically capable of lifting weights which not everyone is. On a more nuanced note, different things work for different people, and gyms aren't the optimal mental healing environment for everyone. If you're gonna arrange everyone on a hypothetical comfort spectrum between gym and library, it seems reasonable that some people wou…

Gyms are the most boring place to get exercise. Go out and enjoy nature, I am sure that will double the benefits of getting exercise if its in order to treat depression.

That's definitely true. I hike pretty regularly, I went hiking here just a few days ago:

https://tinyurl.com/yd58grex

However, you can really only do that between april and november here. There's four months of the year where going on any meaningful hike is absolutely only for people who are totally dedicated and have thousands of dollars of gear, plenty of experience and have been guided on that specific track during winter at least once. Those are the same four months when there's no sunlight and the seasonal depression sets in. I'm not in that league and I'm not embarrassed about it.

The whole "just exercise, it's great and easy" shtick is kinda naive and TBH vaguely annoying. Lots of people, even quite wealthy people, live in circumstances where it's actually just not easy, at least not all the time, and exercise kinda only works for mental health if it's regular. You should see the tires on the bikes that the cyclists who try to keep form during the winter here have to use just on city pavements.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#76

I tried Psychedelics for my depression, and my roommate has been self medicating similarly. I think they can help - but they're going to make the current opioid epidemic look like child's play. I have very carefully limited my intake - and I'm finding that I don't like a lot of what I've found. I'm definitely finding my roommate is becoming a worse person, and well on the way to all of the ugly things that we associa…

What are the ugly things associated with psychedelic drug use? I would think the 'worst' would be becoming a full blown hippie and remove yourself from society but still that would be a personal choice. What are the traits you see as a worse person?

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#77
post #16
post #9

I've had great experiences with LSD, experiences that may have even changed my trajectory in life. That being said I would never recommend LSD to someone undergoing serious mental health issues. IMO not safe at all, you can really end up in a bad place.

A clinical setting is far different than giving someone some tabs and letting them loose at a concert or house party.

A clinic, concert, or house party are all terrible settings for taking LSD. They are confined, crowded spaces. You want something wide open, in nature. Try the mountains, or the desert.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#78
post #7

I could see this seriously being a net positive in the care of people say dying from cancer, depression from paralysis etc. Not all of us can lift weights or simply go for a walk, but our minds yearn to be free.

This is already being done. In Switzerland.

Summary: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4086777/

The MD's website [in german]: http://www.petergasser.ch/

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#79
post #15

I’m really worried about the subset of the population with preexisting mental disorders such as manic depressive disorder, schizophrenia, and depression who will suffer a psychotic break from the use of these substances. Maybe I’m wrong, but from what I’ve heard and read it seems like there’s no way to know what will happen until you try it. A certain percentage of the population goes to hell in the most literal sens…

i'm of the opinion that the psychotic breaks risk would be an engineering problem to overcome in the context of using psychedelics therapeutically.

besides, in a clinical context, it's highly unlikely any kind of psychotic break could get too far out of hand; an astute clinician would recognize the patient spiraling out of their control and administer a correcting dose of an anxiolytic, or, failing that, a trip-ender like an antipsychotic.

Re: Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study

#80
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I’m really worried about the subset of the population with preexisting mental disorders such as manic depressive disorder, schizophrenia, and depression who will suffer a psychotic break from the use of these substances." Psychedelics have been used to treat schizophrenia and depression before. Here is an excerpt from a paper on "Treatment of Childhood Schizophrenia Utilizing LSD and Psilocybin" [1]: The first patie…

> She was a very intelligent girl, perhaps an ancient soul. The author suffers from psychosis. Many people accept psychosis as normal. PS: Removed the word "religion" to prevent a religious flamewar.

Please don't break the site guideline against name-calling in arguments, and please especially don't take threads into religious flamewar.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

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