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New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

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31–40 of 94 posts

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#31
post #10

> "To date, Autopilot resources have rightly focused entirely on safety. With V9, we will begin to enable full self-driving features," he said. Running cars into medians at 70 mph is the result of "focus[ing] entirely on safety?" Now they're going to focus on other things, besides safety?

yeah like collision avoidance, which is not safety /s

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#32
post #29

When is Tesla going to bite the bullet and issue a full recall so they can retrofit all existing Tesla cars with LIDAR? They are still claiming on their website: > "All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver." ...but without LIDAR that simply isn't true. Either the accident…

Tesla disagrees with you on this, they are still operating with the belief that cameras will eventually be superior and cheaper compared to LIDAR.

https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-s...

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#33
post #27
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're changing the meaning by adding the word "related." Say Microsoft stated it would "will begin to enable full 8K features" on the XBox One. That would mean that something would be in 8K--maybe just for movies but not games. It wouldn't mean "features related to 8K" but not a actually being able to display 8K video anywhere.

Your interpretation seems to be that if the car is ever in a "fully autonomous" state, then it's "fully autonomous". Thus if a "fully autonomous feature" is enabled (such as on the highway), that's full autonomy even if that feature is disabled automatically in other situations (such as in the city). Some people would interpret "fully autonomous" to mean end-to-end autonomy, sort of like enabling a "full encryption"…

That is my interpretation, yes. "Fully self-driving features" means the car is self-driving at least some of the time. So a fully autonomous mode that's only active on the highway in good weather counts, but not modes where the human still has to pay attention, or features that only support but do not actually enable full autonomy at least some of the time.

Even limited full-autonomy seems totally out of the reach of Tesla given what we know to date.

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#34
I'm worried he's talking about going from what the NHTSA calls level 2 to level 3 autonomy[1], where the car is capable of navigating all the way to the destination but the driver has to remain alert for potential dangerous situations. That's probably an even worse idea in terms of people actually complying than the existing level 2 autonomy and I think Waymo is absolutely right in trying to skip straight to level 4/5 autonomy where you don't need a human paying constant attention.

[1]https://www.nhtsa.gov/technology-innovation/automated-vehicl...

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#35
post #20

To make it clear: the headline is completely wrong. Musk only announced a step towards autonomy which could be anything, but certainly not full autonomy. It could be as simple as extended self parking. From a software engineering perspective it is an interesting announcement. With all the obvious limitations of the current autopilot, Tesla must have been working on a very different package for full autonomy - we migh…

Exactly! It is absurd how people hear Elon Musk say, "we will begin to enable full self-driving features..." and then conclude that Elon Musk was talking about full self-driving features. They are all just Tesla haters!

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#36
post #27
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're changing the meaning by adding the word "related." Say Microsoft stated it would "will begin to enable full 8K features" on the XBox One. That would mean that something would be in 8K--maybe just for movies but not games. It wouldn't mean "features related to 8K" but not a actually being able to display 8K video anywhere.

Your interpretation seems to be that if the car is ever in a "fully autonomous" state, then it's "fully autonomous". Thus if a "fully autonomous feature" is enabled (such as on the highway), that's full autonomy even if that feature is disabled automatically in other situations (such as in the city). Some people would interpret "fully autonomous" to mean end-to-end autonomy, sort of like enabling a "full encryption"…

Whether or not rayiner is correct in his interpretation, I think it's pretty clear his interpretation is not an outlandish one. By that I mean many other people in the general public will share his interpretation, and unlike rayiner many of those people will be blissfully unaware of the problems with automation Tesla has been having.

What this means is that a large number of people are going to be deceived by statements like this from Musk, even if you think what Musk is saying is technically true, because they interpreted/misinterpreted Musk's statement the same way rayiner did.

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#37
post #10

> "To date, Autopilot resources have rightly focused entirely on safety. With V9, we will begin to enable full self-driving features," he said. Running cars into medians at 70 mph is the result of "focus[ing] entirely on safety?" Now they're going to focus on other things, besides safety?

n=1

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#38
post #29

When is Tesla going to bite the bullet and issue a full recall so they can retrofit all existing Tesla cars with LIDAR? They are still claiming on their website: > "All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver." ...but without LIDAR that simply isn't true. Either the accident…

I believe Elon has stated it should not be necessary. However, he also tweetes if his compsny comes to find there is no other way without Lidar they will figure a way to upgrade the hardware at no additional cost to those who have prepaid for it.

Re: New Tesla software to offer 'full' autonomy, Musk says

#40
post #29

When is Tesla going to bite the bullet and issue a full recall so they can retrofit all existing Tesla cars with LIDAR? They are still claiming on their website: > "All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver." ...but without LIDAR that simply isn't true. Either the accident…

Tesla disagrees with you on this, they are still operating with the belief that cameras will eventually be superior and cheaper compared to LIDAR. https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/7/16988628/elon-musk-lidar-s...

I know they disagree with me, they have multiple reasons to bury their heads in the sand. Admitting they were wrong would be a PR disaster, it would probably hurt Elon's ego, and a recall to retrofit LIDAR would probably be extremely costly.

But if you talk with the leading experts in the field of car automation, the research groups who are actually making it work to some degree today, they are all using LIDAR. Furthermore you have people like the CTO of Mobileye saying that Tesla was trying to push Mobileye's tech beyond what it's capable of (past tense was, because Mobileye apparently dropped Tesla over this, prompting Tesla to develop their own presumably equivalent non-LIDAR solution in house): https://arstechnica.com/cars/2016/09/tesla-dropped-by-mobile...

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