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GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

amasad.me

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Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#41

Post by detaro »

janeroe wrote: post #39
realSlavojTrump wrote: post #31

There's evidence in the literature that shows that there are systemic biases against women in github pull requests, even when in the aggregate women may display greater levels of competence. https://peerj.com/articles/cs-111/ To suggest that pull requests are a good hiring signal (as the author does in explicitly endorsing the "screening" of open source maintainers) ignores this bias. That can be positive or negative…

> systemic biases against women in github pull requests Did you read your link? > The hypothesis is not only false, but it is in the opposite direction than expected; women tend to have their pull requests accepted at a higher rate than men! This difference is statistically significant

... unless they can be easily identified as women from their profile, at which point their acceptance rate drops.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#42

Post by lucb1e »

sanxiyn wrote: post #26

I think the obviously right choice is: Do not require open source contributions, but do not ignore them. Similarly: Do not require degrees, computer science or otherwise, but do not ignore them.

Staying away from extremes and finding a middle way is generally good advice. Indeed never go 100% for degrees nor 100% for open source contributions.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#43

Post by buro9 »

Ignoring the debate around "that tweet" Github is great for those with an interest to be able to self-teach and self-learn. To acquire experience from doing, by being able to see how others have done it before or to take that and use it.

Github is to this generation of programmers, what View Source was to the early web generation of programmers.

Without View Source in 1996, and with no resource to education or work at that time, I would not have learned how to make complete web sites and then have moved to automatically making those websites (HTML generation via a CMS).

Github is important and critical, but not for hiring those already in the industry... for learning and to make this industry accessible to those who are under privileged in terms of access to education, mentoring, code clubs, etc. And then for recognising those people during hiring and giving them the break they deserve.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#44

Post by icebraining »

amasad wrote: post #40
gaius wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

when you're young you frankly don't need a whole lot of sleep So, you are perpetuating ageism then. Let’s see how cocky you are in 10, 20, 30 years when you can’t get a job because of all the bloggers crowing about their Github profiles...

Since I'm talking about programming I'm also perpetuating ableism because you need to have functioning hands and eyes. I'm also perpetuating alivism because you need to be not dead.

you need to have functioning hands and eyes.

That's not actually the case! Blind programmers are not rare, and as for the other: https://venturebeat.com/2014/10/01/max-strzelecki-warlocks/

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#45

Post by amasad »

icebraining wrote: post #44
amasad wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since I'm talking about programming I'm also perpetuating ableism because you need to have functioning hands and eyes. I'm also perpetuating alivism because you need to be not dead.

you need to have functioning hands and eyes. That's not actually the case! Blind programmers are not rare, and as for the other: https://venturebeat.com/2014/10/01/max-strzelecki-warlocks/

That's inspiring. Thanks for sharing!

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#46

Post by tranchms »

“For example, it's hard for me as an individual Muslim to change the fact that some people hate Muslims, so it's better for me to focus my energy on things that I can control. This, however, doesn't mean that as a society we shouldn't discuss issues of discrimination.“

Whoa.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#47

Post by rectang »

It is unavoidable that privilege affects who contributes to open source and how much. Whether or not this is bad is a philosophical issue: is it bad that life is unfair?

The harm comes when people deny the existence of privilege and other forms of luck, and attribute success to their own moral superiority and the moral inferiority of others.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#48

Post by realSlavojTrump »

janeroe wrote: post #39
realSlavojTrump wrote: post #31

There's evidence in the literature that shows that there are systemic biases against women in github pull requests, even when in the aggregate women may display greater levels of competence. https://peerj.com/articles/cs-111/ To suggest that pull requests are a good hiring signal (as the author does in explicitly endorsing the "screening" of open source maintainers) ignores this bias. That can be positive or negative…

> systemic biases against women in github pull requests Did you read your link? > The hypothesis is not only false, but it is in the opposite direction than expected; women tend to have their pull requests accepted at a higher rate than men! This difference is statistically significant

Did you read the abstract?

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#49

Post by golergka »

rectang wrote: post #47

It is unavoidable that privilege affects who contributes to open source and how much. Whether or not this is bad is a philosophical issue: is it bad that life is unfair? The harm comes when people deny the existence of privilege and other forms of luck, and attribute success to their own moral superiority and the moral inferiority of others.

Fairness and morals in general are leaky abstractions that only apply to a subset of all possible situations.

The most "fair" system can't survive a single generation of you allow parents to invest their resources in competitive advantage for their children – which is one of the most basic human desires.

Re: GitHub and Open-Source Is a Boon for the Underprivileged

#50

Post by jakobegger »

I think we should stop looking for the One True Way and accept that there are multiple ways to evaluate job applicants.

Some companies will hire only people from top schools, other companies put a lot of focus on understanding algorithms; other companies just look at your previous jobs, and some may just look at your Github profile.

If you are looking for a job, you need to understand that, and apply to the right companies. Depending on your background, not every company might be a great fit.

If a CS degree is a hard requirement, and you don't have one, then applying at that job is a waste of time.

If you're applying to a company that works on Open Source and they have popular, public Github repos, and you have a blank Github account without any contributions, you're not going to make a good impression.

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