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Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

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Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#91

Post by watwut »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #46

I"m not really a fan of the GDPR. I don't think it really protects privacy. I think it just uses the power of the EU, a fairly big and strong organization, to intimidate the rest of the world to comply with laws that it really shouldn't have legal jurisdiction to enforce globally. I think this is a scary precedent to set that the biggest bully on the block can de facto enforce such standards because the rest of the w…

There are multiple professions where not participating online is quite disadvantage.

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#93

Post by foepys »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #46

I"m not really a fan of the GDPR. I don't think it really protects privacy. I think it just uses the power of the EU, a fairly big and strong organization, to intimidate the rest of the world to comply with laws that it really shouldn't have legal jurisdiction to enforce globally. I think this is a scary precedent to set that the biggest bully on the block can de facto enforce such standards because the rest of the w…

What you are saying is: don't use the internet.

Google, Facebook, Twitter, etc. got websites to implement their like buttons everywhere. The information gathered by them is collected and everybody is being tracked wherever they go.

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#94

Post by danShumway »

DanBC wrote: post #53
danShumway wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No lawyers required. Phrases like this just sound weird to me. If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, from a business perspective I have always been taught that you avoid it, period, until you get a lawyer. I wonder if this is a cultural difference between the US and EU? Might explain some of the different reactions people have had to the legislation.

> If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, Which bit of GDPR introduces that risk?

Maybe sue isn't the correct term, but you are talking about potentially a 20 million dollar fine.

I'm being told that the EU would never pursue that with a small business and they'd just tell you what you need to fix.

That also sounds weird to me as an American. I'm not saying it isn't true, just that it's not the way I'm used to thinking about laws.

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#95

Post by ryandrake »

Sir_Substance wrote: post #43
danShumway wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No lawyers required. Phrases like this just sound weird to me. If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, from a business perspective I have always been taught that you avoid it, period, until you get a lawyer. I wonder if this is a cultural difference between the US and EU? Might explain some of the different reactions people have had to the legislation.

>If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, from a business perspective I have always been taught that you avoid it, period, until you get a lawyer. Bad news: If you have a business, people can attempt to sue your business for whatever they want, and you might have to defend against it. There is nothing on the books that says lawsuits have to be reasonable before they can be filed, only that people…

Not just businesses. Anyone can get sued for any reason. If your blanket policy really is “I won’t do anything if I risk getting sued” you literally can’t even leave your house.

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#96

Post by DanBC »

bovermyer wrote: post #85

The GDPR seems to me to be just another example of nontechnical authorities trying to regulate what they don't understand. Why don't more technical people become politicians, or at least form lobbying groups or think tanks?

The response to the GDPR seems to me to be a bunch of people who fundamentally misunderstand how law works, especially in Europe, and who have a pathological relationship to regulators because their own legal system is fucked beyond all recognition.

GDPR requires you to only gather the data you need; only keep it for as long as you need it; tell people what you're doing with it; and allow them to correct it if it's wrong. How is that too hard?

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#97

Post by [deleted] »

watwut wrote: post #91
DoreenMichele wrote: post #46

I"m not really a fan of the GDPR. I don't think it really protects privacy. I think it just uses the power of the EU, a fairly big and strong organization, to intimidate the rest of the world to comply with laws that it really shouldn't have legal jurisdiction to enforce globally. I think this is a scary precedent to set that the biggest bully on the block can de facto enforce such standards because the rest of the w…

There are multiple professions where not participating online is quite disadvantage.

[deleted]

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#98

Post by drivingmenuts »

subway wrote: post #47
danShumway wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No lawyers required. Phrases like this just sound weird to me. If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, from a business perspective I have always been taught that you avoid it, period, until you get a lawyer. I wonder if this is a cultural difference between the US and EU? Might explain some of the different reactions people have had to the legislation.

Despite all the bluster to the contrary, in the US we avoid accepting responsibility for our actions at all costs. To the point that business schools now effectively teach that the correct strategy is to put your fingers in your ears, and yell "la la la" until somebody actually smacks you.

The legal climate here is different. If you accept responsibility, you will be sued, by victims for possible monetary losses and/or by prosecutors for possible criminal liability. If you stonewall, you might get sued for (see previous) but you might not if it's too expensive.

I don't know if it's a social thing or a legal thing or some combination or what, but apparently it's harder to sue in other parts of the world.

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#99

Post by DanBC »

danShumway wrote: post #94
DanBC wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there's a risk that someone could sue you over something, Which bit of GDPR introduces that risk?

Maybe sue isn't the correct term, but you are talking about potentially a 20 million dollar fine. I'm being told that the EU would never pursue that with a small business and they'd just tell you what you need to fix. That also sounds weird to me as an American. I'm not saying it isn't true, just that it's not the way I'm used to thinking about laws.

European law tends to talk about the maximum available penalty under the worst possible situation. It then gives a list of factors to be taken into account. I'm not sure why that's a bad thing.

Look at the US COPPA, with potentially $41,000 per violation. Why isn't this more scary for American website operators? https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/com...

> A court can hold operators who violate the Rule liable for civil penalties of up to $41,484 per violation. The amount of civil penalties a court assesses may turn on a number of factors, including the egregiousness of the violations, whether the operator has previously violated the Rule, the number of children involved, the amount and type of personal information collected, how the information was used, whether it was shared with third parties, and the size of the company. Information about the FTC’s COPPA enforcement actions, including the amounts of civil penalties obtained, can be found by clicking on the Case Highlights link in the FTC’s Business Center.

I mean, any US website that's compliant with COPPA should find GDPR to be a doddle.

https://corporate.findlaw.com/law-library/ftc-imposes-larges...

Re: Shutting Down Forum (GDPR)

#100

Post by drivingmenuts »

amyjess wrote: post #42
weberc2 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does GDPR affect people in other countries with no interest in doing business in Europe? If I host a forum in the US and you ask me to remove your posts and I tell you where to stick it, what legal consequences might I face? Erm, asking for a friend.

As much as I dislike Donald Trump, I am willing to hold my nose here and suggest encouraging the Trump Administration to go full MAGA and direct Congress to pass laws explicitly stating that no foreign judgements or fines may be enforced on US citizens.

Yes, and then they just wait until you show up on their soil (say, on vacation) and arrest you then.

Remember Assange? He's fine as long as he stays in the embassy, but step into the back alley for a smoke and he's off to the hoosegow.

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