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Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

theverge.com

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Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#121

Post by justincormack »

princekolt wrote: post #78
bthdonohue wrote: post #5

Hey all – Brian from Instapaper here. We worked really hard to try to avoid a service interruption in the EU, but unfortunately we were unable to. We continue to work hard to ensure that the service interruption is as brief as possible. Let me know if you have any questions...

You know that you're still liable for European customer's data, even if you're offline, right? Going offline won't change anything. You can't effectively grab the database and run away.

Presumably they deleted all the EU data just now...

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#122

Post by Hamuko »

bthdonohue wrote: post #38
mantas wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you hard-banning or is it possible to use it over VPN or in some other way? Asking for a friend!

The ban will be an IP-based ban for IPs from countries in the EU.

And how hard are you going to be dropping EU users' data?

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#123

Post by ewretgg »

taysic wrote: post #100
ewretgg wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> GDPR could have safeguarded data by demanding more transparency That would be a toothless regulation. It would just cause businesses to add more crap to their privacy policies, which nobody reads anyway, and doesn't impact user behavior. > It's not obvious why they are requiring apps to provide the same service for free 'without detriment' So that users can opt-out of having unnecessary data collected. You should o…

If they were smart about how transparent a business needed to be, I don't think it would be toothless at all. It would have given users more information about what is happening behind the scenes and allowed them to make their own decisions. > So that users can opt-out of having unnecessary data collected. You should only be collecting the data needed to run the service. If your business collapses when users opt-out,…

I don't agree, but at least I understand where you're coming from. Here is the stasis of our dispute:

> I would argue most of these things make the world a better place not a worse place. And that people should be able to choose how they want to pay for those services.

I'm not convinced any of the apps we pay for in data really improve our lives. The price we pay in control over our identity and our information usually outweighs the benefits. And in some cases, like in many distracting social apps or pay-to-win games, there is no benefit. The app is just designed to addict us, keep us occupied, and make our lives worse.

Furthermore, I don't think "allowing users to decide for themselves" is going to make a difference. That's like allowing poison in food, because everyone can scan the ingredients on the label for known poisons. It's unreasonable to expect the average person to do due diligence on every service they use online.

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#124

Post by sdhgaiojfsa »

Dayshine wrote: post #76
bthdonohue wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The scope of work for GDPR was underestimated by me, we were not able to complete that work for the deadline on Friday, and this was the required alternative. We are working very hard to minimize the service interruption.

Have you received genuine legal advice that recommended that you shut down business instead of continuing to work towards compliance? The agencies that can enforce the GPDR want you to be compliant, not to fine you... If you're actually working towards compliance past evidence shows they won't fine you.

I've heard this line a lot, but even as a government loving liberal it doesn't sound very compelling to me. The law says, comply or face fines up to 4% of global revenue. It doesn't say, "make a best effort to comply, or face fines up to 4% of global revenue." I'm very reluctant to trust people who can fine me for that much money that they won't do so. This is especially the case because it appears to some of us foreigners that the EU particularly loves to fine foreign companies for large amounts despite what appears, from our perspective, to be a good faith attempt that to comply with the law.

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#125

Post by jacquesm »

pembrook wrote: post #120
jacquesm wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense. Instapaper was acquired by Pinterest.

And how much revenue does the Instapaper service generate for Pinterest? Lower profile groups within big companies are probably most likely to shut off their services to European users because they have the cautious legal departments of the large company without the important profit center designation which would make compliance a priority.

> And how much revenue does the Instapaper service generate for Pinterest?

Who cares? That's not a factor in whether or not you should comply with the law.

> Lower profile groups within big companies are probably most likely to shut off their services to European users because they have the cautious legal departments of the large company without the important profit center designation which would make compliance a priority.

Well, that may be their strategy but it won't work because it is the company that is violating the law, not the lower profile group.

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#126

Post by microtonal »

tobltobs wrote: post #73
dejv wrote: post #39

What are good alternatives to Instapaper? There is Pocket, any other recomendation? Maybe it is also time for somebody to create new app as tiny side apps owned by corporations seems to be sunseted sooner or later.

Creating new apps has just become more effort, while monetization options have become more difficult.

So? Profit maximization of the developer is not the only thing that matters, users deserve to be protected as well.

Applications have become terrible in this respect. I use Little Snitch and see many paid applications report to Google Analytics. I don’t want the developer to know how often and how I use the application, let alone Google.

Technical users know how to use an application firewall, uBlock or uMatrix. But the average user was robbed of their privacy without them even knowing, let alone having any choice. The GDPR finally corrects this.

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#127

Post by Kiro »

jacquesm wrote: post #125
pembrook wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how much revenue does the Instapaper service generate for Pinterest? Lower profile groups within big companies are probably most likely to shut off their services to European users because they have the cautious legal departments of the large company without the important profit center designation which would make compliance a priority.

> And how much revenue does the Instapaper service generate for Pinterest? Who cares? That's not a factor in whether or not you should comply with the law. > Lower profile groups within big companies are probably most likely to shut off their services to European users because they have the cautious legal departments of the large company without the important profit center designation which would make compliance a pr…

> it is the company that is violating the law, not the lower profile group.

I work in a company that was acquired and we're still our own legal entity. Would our owner be affected if we violate GDPR?

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#128

Post by Tomte »

sdhgaiojfsa wrote: post #124
Dayshine wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you received genuine legal advice that recommended that you shut down business instead of continuing to work towards compliance? The agencies that can enforce the GPDR want you to be compliant, not to fine you... If you're actually working towards compliance past evidence shows they won't fine you.

I've heard this line a lot, but even as a government loving liberal it doesn't sound very compelling to me. The law says, comply or face fines up to 4% of global revenue. It doesn't say, "make a best effort to comply, or face fines up to 4% of global revenue." I'm very reluctant to trust people who can fine me for that much money that they won't do so. This is especially the case because it appears to some of us fore…

The EU regularly fines domestic companies huge amounts in anti-trust enforcement.

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#129

Post by pmontra »

bthdonohue wrote: post #43
Angostura wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, as The Verge says in the article: 'While we don’t know exactly what’s holding up Instapaper' I'm naturally curious as to what's holding up Instapaper. As you say, your Privacy Policy is very good, other than the disclaimer that says 'we may pass your personal data to others - who knows what they do with it eh?'. I imagine that this is the issue which is holding you up.

The scope of work for GDPR was underestimated by me, we were not able to complete that work for the deadline on Friday, and this was the required alternative. We are working very hard to minimize the service interruption.

Shutting down means you're probably not gathering any further data but what if one of your EU users sends you mail now asking for all the data you have about him/her? How does the shut down protects you about that?

Re: Instapaper is temporarily shutting off access for European users due to GDPR

#130

Post by jacquesm »

Kiro wrote: post #127
jacquesm wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And how much revenue does the Instapaper service generate for Pinterest? Who cares? That's not a factor in whether or not you should comply with the law. > Lower profile groups within big companies are probably most likely to shut off their services to European users because they have the cautious legal departments of the large company without the important profit center designation which would make compliance a pr…

> it is the company that is violating the law, not the lower profile group. I work in a company that was acquired and we're still our own legal entity. Would our owner be affected if we violate GDPR?

No, in that case the owner is just a shareholder. But if the original legal entity no longer exists (which I believe is the case with Instapaper) then it doesn't matter that you've been acquired, you are now part of the mothership.
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