Question should be re-framed as, of what is an undergrad degree a "costly and honest signal"?
College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
101–110 of 437 posts
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which is probably a good thing, since it will slowly beat into the minds of upper-levels at corps and recruiters that a College Degree shouldn't be the minimum bar applicants need to reach, and maybe some of these companies will start removing the "has degree" band reject filter.
Even if not all college degrees are worthwhile, it doesn't mean that companies are wrong to want college degrees. In fact, it's probably true that the highest-paid, highest-skill jobs have the most genuine need for college degrees. And for the rest, virtue signaling is a real thing: if you have more applicants than jobs, you set up high filters to winnow the pool.
Winnow the pool to rich people who can afford college that is.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#103I assert the expense of college is an awful burden to put on someone who must finance most of it through debt. It's a gamble. You can improve your odds of a happy outcome in that gamble by looking at the Student Loan Default Rate for any given major at any given college, and picking the best program for you (with the lowest default rate possible.) But if you are a child of parents who can finance your college? Absolu…
The tax increases you would need to sustain a system like that would be absolutely devastating. Also, college degrees would mean a lot less if they're free- devaluing them for people who actually paid for them
Our current Student Loan Debts ARE absolutely devastating.
If you knew that an applicant had a Full Ride Merit Scholarship to a good degree program, it would "mean less" to you?
Can you explain that a little bit better?
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#104Every modern society needs it's signaling mechanic, otherwise it becomes virtually impossible for people to want to take risks, eliminating all ladder access for the underprivileged. Signals only work if they're hard to fake. The expense of a college degree in both time and dollars perversely increases its utility as a signal. Of course, the price of a degree can only go so high before before people are unwilling to…
Spoken like a true armchair economist.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#105[deleted]
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#106This massively misrepresents Tim Bartik's work on the topic. Bartik wrote a long thread here:Check out @TimBartik’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/TimBartik/status/996865804179263489?s=09
Reading the article I thought to myself that it’s a crappy piece that oversimplifies the complex landscape and tries to draw sensationalist conclusions... but after reading the Tweeter thread by the very scientist who’s work is cited, the article looks intentionally false and a retraction worthy. Instead of saying that college is not worth it, why don’t we do MORE to make it free? Even if people don’t end up using th…
It's an opinion piece so based on what I've read in the NYT(or the WSJ, doesn't matter the ostensible political leanings of the paper in question) there will never be a retraction and the editorial board will double down on backing the editorial.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#107Earlier quoted context omitted.
it's already a shame that the answer isn't 100% yes, 100% of the time. back in the 70s, tuition was payable with a summer job and job prospects were decent enough despite geopolitical and economic headwinds these days, the same problems plague the job market, but every year of college costs 1 year of salary, unless you qualify for stackable forms of financial aid
People hate when I talk about working fulltime in the factory on the midnight shift and going to school fulltime. I didnt get 'the college experience'. But I didnt have any college debt, I became a hardened adult that didnt cry when plant people got pissed. I dont complain. If something needs to get done, I do it. Graduated in 3 years with my chem engineering degree at age 21. People will always complain about someth…
Why would that experience be aspirational? Why should that be the way we want to structure society?
Especially when other western nations show us that university can be free and people can have a rich college experience without that kind of death march.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which is probably a good thing, since it will slowly beat into the minds of upper-levels at corps and recruiters that a College Degree shouldn't be the minimum bar applicants need to reach, and maybe some of these companies will start removing the "has degree" band reject filter.
Even if not all college degrees are worthwhile, it doesn't mean that companies are wrong to want college degrees. In fact, it's probably true that the highest-paid, highest-skill jobs have the most genuine need for college degrees. And for the rest, virtue signaling is a real thing: if you have more applicants than jobs, you set up high filters to winnow the pool.
You seem to be suggesting that the simple addition of a degree requirement is good because it narrows the search field. By this same argument, I could say I will only accept candidates that are left handed.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#109I assert the expense of college is an awful burden to put on someone who must finance most of it through debt. It's a gamble. You can improve your odds of a happy outcome in that gamble by looking at the Student Loan Default Rate for any given major at any given college, and picking the best program for you (with the lowest default rate possible.) But if you are a child of parents who can finance your college? Absolu…
Student loan interest rates should be tied to the major. Engineering major? $0 down, 3.5% interest rate. Art History major? 25% down, 15% interest rate.
Why not just progressive taxation?
Don't predicate the rate on a hypothetical earning... Base it on actual earnings.
Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore
#110The NYTimes republishes a variant of this articles almost every month https://www.google.com/search?q=site:nytimes.com+college+wor... The usual answer is "it depends"
Which is probably a good thing, since it will slowly beat into the minds of upper-levels at corps and recruiters that a College Degree shouldn't be the minimum bar applicants need to reach, and maybe some of these companies will start removing the "has degree" band reject filter.
Employers are generally looking for a proxy for iq, since testing iq directly has potential legal problems. SAT, ASVAB, grades, degree attainment are often just proxies for iq. I think if Congress passes a law explicitly allowing iq tests for all job applications we'll see many of these seemingly irrational job requirements fade away.