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What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

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Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#71

Post by commandlinefan »

falcolas wrote: post #66
s73v3r_ wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"and we have to pretend we're designers to work around people like this who have no idea how to hire actual technical people." I honestly don't know what you mean by this.

My current resume has approximately 6 different fonts, left and right justified fields, bullet points, and tables just so it looks just good enough to get past the HR drones (many of whom are wonderful people despite being a resume gatekeeper). It was an agonizing process, but the end result is something that recruiters recognize as being well designed. I hate having to maintain it. That's what I mean by pretending.

> 6 different fonts

Dear God, is that really what they're looking for? Tech hiring gets more ridiculous every day.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#72

Post by coldcode »

t1o5 wrote: post #19
jjjensen90 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would add to that: - Don't try to recruit me for the company I work for - Don't constantly ask me for referrals for a $500 bonus from your $20k fee

- And don't ask me if I know "Tomcat programming language"

I would like to here what they say when you say yes.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#73

Post by john_moscow »

mkirklions wrote: post #46
FLUX-YOU wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Literally in my linkedin messages right now: "Hi we're looking for a python/clojure/go/dart/react senior developer. We need 5 years of experience and a college degree in CS" "I have none of those but forward my resume if you think I'd be a good fit" "Alright, I'll get your resume over to them ASAP!" Several days later "Sorry, they said you wouldn't be a good fit" No fucking shit, I am shocked

>we're looking for a python/clojure/go/dart/react senior developer Tbh, most people dont even need an expert or senior developer. Unless you are expected to pick up everything within 1 week, its easy enough to learn a language or reverse engineer old code with enough time. I find this the most annoying thing in programming. Does HR not realize that once you can program, you can program?

HR first and foremost needs to justify their own existence to the company they work for. And the easiest way of doing that is basically showing how they look through hundreds of candidates only to find those rare ones with the correct buzzword in the CV.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#75

Post by tashi »

alkonaut wrote: post #57
falcolas wrote: post #22

In my opinion: - designing your resume - EQ - having a deep, enthusiastic, and genuine interest in some aspect of the company - Think of your resume like a poem - visual representation of their experience/resume These are great criteria for hiring a designer or marketing personnel, but these are TERRIBLE criteria for hiring a technical person. In my fantasy world, a technical resume is in a monospaced font and is emi…

> they would gripe about that technology all day long; if they can't complain about its shortcomings and pitfalls, they didn't use it. I have literally baited people I interview with this type of thing. Asked about things I know everyone who has come in contact with has cut themselves on and been upset about.

Some candidates, depending on their backgrounds, may be wary of being thought of as complainers or being "difficult." Something to look out for.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#76

Post by majormajor »

falcolas wrote: post #59
Consultant32452 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of us aren't on the cutting edge of technology. I've personally never worked on a team whose biggest problem was a lack of technical prowess, the problems are always social/cultural.

If I'm being frank, then you need to be up front about that in the job posting. "Cultural fit" and other PC BS won't cut it - be honest about what you need. "We need someone who can design and implement frontends alongside our product marketing group." Not, "Looking for a JavaScript, Typescript, Angular, React, Node.js, Mongo, and BerkleyDB rockstar." Because I've personally watched several people who were cultural f…

I'm confused by which side you're comparing to the bit in your last sentence to. All they did was fit in and talk? That's not enough.

You have to be able to navigate the work environment and find a way to get stuff delivered. Which your "design and implement" part captures, but "cultural fit and great talker" doesn't.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#77

Post by svnsets »

danesparza wrote: post #6

I would absolutely love to see a thoughtful 'what engineers want from technical recruiters' post.

1) JavaScript !== Java

2) Don't even try to talk about project management frameworks because you don't understand them

3) Don't ask me if I have experience in something that isn't on my resume

4) I don't want your 3 month .NET contract in Cleveland even if it "may have the opportunity to go full-time"

5) Get both my and the employer's salary requirements up front so I don't call out of work to spend the day interviewing, being told by the company that they absolutely wanted to move forward, and then find out that my salary was way out of their range.

6) If you name drop a renown company and then start talking about how I should instead interview at some startup for helping people put their mom in a nursing home, the conversation is over.

7) APIs isn't a skill

8) Save the corporate kool-aid for the product owner candidates

9) Just because you got my phone number because some job board sold my info to you doesn't mean you can call me

10) My resume, LinkedIn, and any other job board profiles have my location listed. Don't call me at 6am PST!!!

11) Stop hoping that I am well. I'd be much more well if I wasn't woken up at 6am by your ass.

12) Who do you honestly think is going to work for a company that requires .NET, Java, Python, Angular, React, and "bonus points for Rust experience"?

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#78

Post by ken »

> It may seem like common sense, but having a deep, enthusiastic, and genuine interest in some aspect of the company (whether it’s the company’s mission, product, technical challenges, or its work environment) is important.

This frustrates me so much. What if I can't find a company that offers any such thing? This seems like anti-common sense to me.

If you have skills at carpentry, and do a professional job, you can get a job at any construction site. Nobody cares if you have a "deep, enthusiastic, genuine interest" in the type of structure, or the challenges of woodworking, or the layout of the job site.

If you have skills at programming, though, you might not even get a job these days if you can't demonstrate that you're sufficiently passionate about what exactly the company does and how they do it.

This isn't a blue/white-collar distinction. I once talked to the industrial design lead at Fluke, and asked if he ended up there because he had a particular interest in test and measurement. He laughed at me and said no, not at all. He just liked industrial design, and didn't much care where he did it, or what he was designing.

If I didn't know any better, I'd say it sounds like you're searching for people with passion so you can get them to work unpaid overtime for you. I don't know why else it would matter.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#79

Post by commandlinefan »

nlstitch wrote: post #3

I think recruiters should actually start giving a shit about the lives of engineers before making demands. - Actually try to get to know and understand a person - Dont use fill-in templates - Have some actual knowledge of tech (java != .net) - Dont make offerings for positions I worked on 10 years ago during college. - Dont be greedy. To just name a few...

> recruiters should actually start giving a shit about the lives of engineers

Well, in their defense, they're almost definitely recruiting for an organization that doesn't, so it would almost be dishonest if they themselves presented a facade of caring much one way or the other beyond their own quarterly sales commissions.

Re: What technical recruiters want from engineering candidates

#80

Post by EADGBE »

mitchty wrote: post #47
nikanj wrote: post #5

I'm surprised none of them mentioned the abominable "culture match". I've heard repeated complaints that it's much more important to be a brogrammer who likes craft beers, than it is to be any good at the actual programming.

I am sooo glad I've not encountered this. When I go drinking I tend to accumulate drinking buddies that are entirely outside of programming. Lawyers, skater bros, confectioners, people that know way too much about the chemistry of post it notes (true story) I love tech and all, but, when I'm out drinking its more fun asking people what they do and just getting out of the stupid tech scene in general. Maybe I'm the we…

Agreed, I don't find myself wanting to be around people like that outside of work. They're... kinda boring.

I always laugh when a recruiter reaches out looking for people and asking if I know of anyone. LOL! No, all the ones I know I currently work with, and I try not to know them past that.

> I don't want to join a cult when I join a job.

My feelings precisely.

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