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I've spent the last two years building a new email client

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Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#491

Post by nobodyaccount »

tomc1985 wrote: post #412
dhruvb14 wrote: post #406

I find it crazy that everyone is harping on Electron instead of the cool features that this clearly has that most clients do not. Demo looked pretty polished dude. Don't let the typical HN crowd rain on your parade. The fact that you posted an actual product out to the public is more than most can say. Also: If you can't spare Max 300MB ram and you are complaining on HN wtf computer do you use?

My compute resources are not an all-you-can-eat buffet. I'm sick of inconsiderate developers writing software in wasteful frameworks that waste my electricity and time. You can make pretty x-platform apps in JavaFX, QT Quick, GTK, hell even Lazarus, and they don't eat CPU and memory like Electron does. It is a shame that nearly every app released in the latter half of this decade is just wasteful Electron garbage. Do…

Get over yourself. I run multiple electron apps all day long without issue.

> You can make pretty x-platform apps in JavaFX, QT Quick, GTK, hell even Lazarus, and they don't eat CPU and memory like Electron does.

lol, if those are your idea of pretty... The reason Electron is popular is because those frameworks are, and have always been, garbage for garbage software.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#493

Post by kuschku »

lucb1e wrote: post #388
lhorie wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minified js isn't particularly hard to reverse engineer compared to tools that are geared towards actual obfuscation, and regardless, you don't even need to look at the code if all you care about is privacy. A look at the dev console's network tab should tell you all you need to know.

I've done obfuscated Javascript on a CTF. Only a few hundred lines and I can tell you, it's way easier to just write it new from scratch, especially if you have a product that you like and can just copy.

I’ve reversed and broken real-life products written in JS, Java, WebAssembly and native code.

Minified JS and obfuscated Java (DexGuard or ProGuard) are almost identical in complexity, you can restore the actual datatypes still, and you can even restore the rough outlines of where control structures were.

Obfuscated WebAssembly, NaCl or native code is much worse to work with, and often data structures and control structures are gone entirely.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#494

Post by nobodyaccount »

dogma1138 wrote: post #24

No offense but unless it’s a 1st party client email clients are something that is very hard to trust. Who controls your client has access to your inbox with most services even the few that have separate IMAP/POP3 passwords like Hushmail can be compromised through it. If your client also integrates with encryption or worse takes charge of it my encryption key is also now at risk. Lastly since email today is pure HTML…

Pretty much everything you said is bullshit, fwiw. Nobody gives a shit about your name drop of firms, nor will not having an audit from any of them impact the target market for this app.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#495

Post by Mithaldu »

spookthesunset wrote: post #468
CryoLogic wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half of Hackernews is discussion about six figure tech salaries, the other half is complaints about 300mb (aka ~$2) ram being to expensive for an app. https://www.anandtech.com/show/9864/price-of-ddr4-memory-dro...

> Half of Hackernews is discussion about six figure tech salaries, the other half is complaints about 300mb (aka ~$2) ram being to expensive for an app. Slashdot got like this eventually. Slashdot was tech site full of luddites complaining about anything new. Worse, slashdot stopped becoming relevant. When the top comment on an article about increased hard drive space was "why does all this stuff take so much space?…

> Your OS will swap the software out when you aren't using it

Wrong, since Electron apps NEVER sit still.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#496

Post by LyndsySimon »

tomc1985 wrote: post #461
dokem wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are taking developers' choice in framework a bit too personally.

And I think most users are far too tolerant of bad decisionmaking

Respectfully, losing a single potential user is not indicative of "bad decisionmaking". It may very well have been an excellent decision, particularly if using Electron allowed them to support macOS and Windows out the door - thereby expanding their target audience significantly.

I get why you don't like Electron apps. I share your position in that. I would expect that if Ivelope grows quickly enough to justify it, time will be spent on improving resource utilization. That could be through scrapping Electron or through optimizing within it - but either way, at this stage "time to market" and "speed of iteration" are much more important than resource utilization.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#497

Post by fermuch »

kuschku wrote: post #493
lucb1e wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've done obfuscated Javascript on a CTF. Only a few hundred lines and I can tell you, it's way easier to just write it new from scratch, especially if you have a product that you like and can just copy.

I’ve reversed and broken real-life products written in JS, Java, WebAssembly and native code. Minified JS and obfuscated Java (DexGuard or ProGuard) are almost identical in complexity, you can restore the actual datatypes still, and you can even restore the rough outlines of where control structures were. Obfuscated WebAssembly, NaCl or native code is much worse to work with, and often data structures and control str…

I'd be very interested about your findings decompiling wasm. Do you have a blog, by chance?

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#499

Post by saagarjha »

mful wrote: post #464
tomc1985 wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My compute resources are not an all-you-can-eat buffet. I'm sick of inconsiderate developers writing software in wasteful frameworks that waste my electricity and time. You can make pretty x-platform apps in JavaFX, QT Quick, GTK, hell even Lazarus, and they don't eat CPU and memory like Electron does. It is a shame that nearly every app released in the latter half of this decade is just wasteful Electron garbage. Do…

God forbid someone spend thousands of hours building a free app in the tech stack they are familiar/productive with...how inconsiderate!

If their tech stack isn't appropriate for the job, then they shouldn't be using it for. We don't have people writing software for space probes in Python.

Re: I've spent the last two years building a new email client

#500

Post by saagarjha »

LyndsySimon wrote: post #496
tomc1985 wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I think most users are far too tolerant of bad decisionmaking

Respectfully, losing a single potential user is not indicative of "bad decisionmaking". It may very well have been an excellent decision, particularly if using Electron allowed them to support macOS and Windows out the door - thereby expanding their target audience significantly. I get why you don't like Electron apps. I share your position in that. I would expect that if Ivelope grows quickly enough to justify it, t…

> Respectfully, losing a single potential user is not indicative of "bad decisionmaking"

It's not just one user that they've lost…

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