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Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

bloomberg.com

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Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#31

Post by meteor333 »

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #14

The scale of this is astounding and wonderful: "China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance."

Isn't that more than total Tesla cars on the road? I presume producing electric buses are much more complicated than cars. Tesla sounds like a lot hype compared with above stats.

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#33

Post by lallysingh »

keithnz wrote: post #32

But, how are they making electricity? Coal?

About 66% is coal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China

But it's on a downtrend. I believe it's a lot easier to clean up centralized sources of pollution (power plants) than diffused ones (vehicles).

I'm mostly worried about batteries and the politics and rare earth metals.

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#34

Post by Kyragem »

losteric wrote: post #7
nothrabannosir wrote: post #5

Is this a submarine PR ad for the Chinese government? Not to take away from the objective positivity of the actual facts, but it feels eerily cheerleady. Almost childish, if nothing else… I count at least five pointless “ha ha look who’s laughing now” and “China is leading the world” in this, and a surprising lack of counterbalance. Perhaps I’m just seeing things? But yes: great.

I think you are seeing things. China is mentioned because they had the worst pollution problems, seriously invested in electric, and are now realizing the payoff. The numbers support the narrative.

We'll have those pollution problems here soon enough, but like so many other problem areas where the US has become world leader in (crime/gun violence/poverty/wealth disparity/healthcare costs/education costs/privacy) nothing will be done about it as long as the 1% are in charge of our politicians.

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#35

Post by seanmcdirmid »

bunfunton wrote: post #26
danans wrote: post #21

It's a strange shift in affairs that China appears to have the greatest incentives (urban pollution, petroleum imports) today to advance clean transportation and energy while the US has stalled or moved backward, at least the Federal level. Western European countries, for whom fossil fuels don't seem to be an identity politics issue like in the US, are also making more progress in electrifying their transportation an…

I believe the individual countries set their own gas prices (taxed highly). All countries buy their oil/gas on the market for roughly the same price

True, but domestic production means the revenue comes back if you aren’t a net importer.

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#38

Post by seanmcdirmid »

meteor333 wrote: post #31
michaelbuckbee wrote: post #14

The scale of this is astounding and wonderful: "China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance."

Isn't that more than total Tesla cars on the road? I presume producing electric buses are much more complicated than cars. Tesla sounds like a lot hype compared with above stats.

It really is about the same. Electric buses aren’t new of course (Seattle has had them forever), but the ability to use them with batteries and without overhead wires is the new thing. In the bus the battery is just much bigger (usually stored on top).

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#39

Post by kaycebasques »

Endama wrote: post #9

I think few people know that a bunch of public transit was actually electric in the early/mid 20th century. Car companies, most notably GM, conspired to convert public transport to gas to make public transit less comfortable compared to private car ownership[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_consp...

The dismantling of LA’s electric public transit system (which more or less happened in real life, if I recall correctly) is the backdrop of the Who Framed Roger Rabbit plotline.

Re: Electric Buses Are Hurting the Oil Industry

#40

Post by seanmcdirmid »

lallysingh wrote: post #33
keithnz wrote: post #32

But, how are they making electricity? Coal?

About 66% is coal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_China But it's on a downtrend. I believe it's a lot easier to clean up centralized sources of pollution (power plants) than diffused ones (vehicles). I'm mostly worried about batteries and the politics and rare earth metals.

China has traditionally had the opposite problem: cars had decent enough emission equipment while coal plants would frequently disable their own (coal contributed to more of Beijing’s problem than vehicle emissions, mainly because of poorly operated heating plants). With the crack down on pollution, that is changing, though the real clean up happens when they move off coal (to NG, renewables, and nuclear).
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