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Time to rebuild the web?

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Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#141

Post by icc97 »

freehunter wrote: post #82
icc97 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually that makes a lot of sense, it's not that we need to have RSS replace Facebook, we need a resurgance of forums to take back from Facebook. Perhaps if forums could talk to each other you'd have an experience more like mastodon, but in concepts that more people understand. Something like an open source Stack Exchange network. So you can log-in to one of them but then easily create an account using the credentia…

Sounds like subreddits.

The reddit model is more centralised than I'd imagined.

Each forum could still have their own domain and installation.

Ideally it would be in some way compatible to existing forums.

Perhaps better integration of forums via RSS. One thing regular forums tend to still have is RSS feeds built in. They can also be a nice go between of email and online users (although as has been said many times, email an be the death of forums).

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#142

Post by klez »

zimpenfish wrote: post #116
arkh wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like the idea of a text-only browser Lynx is still available.

Bloody useless for ~90% of the current web though.

Take the HN frontpage as it is right now. I bet you can read a good 80% of the links with lynx and company right now (except, ironically, for the comment on HN itself because they are not correctly indented).

The actual problematic part of the web from the command line is dynamic web application (in this case I see a couple of links to youtube).

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#143

Post by kristianc »

emddudley wrote: post #136
kristianc wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which works great, until ISPs start offering subsidized plans for Facebook, Gmail, Spotify, Twitter, and expensive plans for everything else. When that happens, there is very little economic incentive to have smaller websites, smaller e-commerce websites end up being part of Amazon, and Google starts providing more and more of its own content.

I agree that could be an outcome, but could there not also be a reverse "Eternal September" where niche communities thrive? Since people would need to make a conscious, meaningful choice to join them?

The evidence thus far has seemed to suggest that when deprived of the oxygen of search & RSS traffic & the independent blogosphere and niche communities have withered on the vine. Less traffic and less commenting means less incentive to post, which means less posting. What seems to have happened is people have gathered around the last remaining campfires for warmth.

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#144

Post by john_minsk »

ElCapitanMarkla wrote: post #99
freehunter wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like subreddits.

I was reading something the other day about how reddit has killed the community feel of forums. And thinking about it I agree, I can remember pre reddit I used to be reasonably active on a few forums, made friends etc. Reddit interactions feel a lot more ephemeral if that’s the right word.

I feel you. But my 2 cents on this:we just got old, lazy and wise...

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#145

Post by martin_drapeau »

skummetmaelk wrote: post #138
martin_drapeau wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking will kill you. Liking funny cat videos on Facebook won't. I think you are comparing oranges and apples here.

Poor privacy choices can severely damage your future career and thereby quality of life. I'd say that is also pretty severe.

That is a good point. If any type of legislation should come out of this, it should be about usage of social media data by companies. They should not be able to discriminate people because of things they do in their private lives. In fact, they shouldn't have the right to investigate it unless it relates to the job (i.e. checking that a community manager does in fact use Twitter and Facebook in an efficient way). There may be exceptions but for 90% of the jobs out there - it makes no sense.

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#146

Post by pjmlp »

naranha wrote: post #35
adrianN wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't think of a single desktop application that has been made obsolete by a SPA.

IDEs -> vscode thunderbird ->Gmail Ms office > gdocs Msn messenger -> Hangouts Etc. At least for most (non professional) users Edit: and often you are better off using webapps because they are sandboxed.

Webapps sandbox is useless when they actually need someone's else computer to do any valuable work.

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#147

Post by ataturk »

jen729w wrote: post #45
martin_drapeau wrote: post #30

When I ask friends and family who use Facebook daily, privacy and security never come up as pain points. Media is blowing everything out of proportion. Replacing Facebook with RSS or Feedly is nonsense. My friends and family have no idea what those are. Facebook makes it easy for people to connect with old friends and family members through active human interactions: like this, follow her, read that. By doing so you…

One of the few times I’ve heard a counter to this was an old fisherman who took us out on a boat here in Melbourne, Australia. Proper bloke, skin like leather from the sun, done nothing but run fishing trips his whole life. He was lamenting the loss of a particular forum with one of the other guys. “All just on Facebook now”, he said, and he said it with sadness. He missed that old forum.

What is most disgusting about Facebook is how, like the telcos, they are feeding the data directly to the intelligence agencies. This is not theoretical, this is a sweeping change of how western governments treat their so-called citizens. If everything is tracked, what's different about us vs. East Germany or the Soviet Union? You know, those countries that we always despised as being total hellholes?

The US is running up towards some very violent times because the soft-gloved oppression always gives way to the iron fist.

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#148

Post by oneeyedpigeon »

astura wrote: post #83
icc97 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually that makes a lot of sense, it's not that we need to have RSS replace Facebook, we need a resurgance of forums to take back from Facebook. Perhaps if forums could talk to each other you'd have an experience more like mastodon, but in concepts that more people understand. Something like an open source Stack Exchange network. So you can log-in to one of them but then easily create an account using the credentia…

Isn't this basically Reddit?

I think they were raising the possibility of having multiple reedits, each owned by a separate entity, yet still compatible. Like we have multiple email providers, for example.

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#149

Post by icc97 »

exergy wrote: post #84
icc97 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually that makes a lot of sense, it's not that we need to have RSS replace Facebook, we need a resurgance of forums to take back from Facebook. Perhaps if forums could talk to each other you'd have an experience more like mastodon, but in concepts that more people understand. Something like an open source Stack Exchange network. So you can log-in to one of them but then easily create an account using the credentia…

I do not get discourse. I've only ever come across it on Jeff's own blog, but it seems no different to Disqus. And both don't load with uMatrix without manually activating them. I don't want more Javascript in my life. I want more static forum posts.

Disqus is a centralised data harvester and no better than Facebook as far as I can tell.

Discourse is just another forum software, but it's open source and you can setup your own. Jeff's taken some of the ideas from StackOverflow and tried to apply them to forums. To be honest I think most people are happy with regular forums, they work as you expect and there aren't many rules to learn. I've come across Discourse forums a couple of times. Plotly charts use Discourse for their forum [0]. They work well, but as you say Discourse tried to rebrand the forum and so introduces a layer that most people just won't get.

[0]: https://community.plot.ly/

Re: Time to rebuild the web?

#150

Post by ekianjo »

skummetmaelk wrote: post #94
arvinsim wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet a lot of people smoke.

In the US there has been a steady decline: https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/tables/trends/ci... Almost three quarters of all smokers in the US want to quit: http://news.gallup.com/poll/163763/smokers-quit-tried-multip... I think it is pretty clear that the information and social stigma campaigns run by people who care about the health of their fellow citizens have been effective.

in many other countries smoking is on the increase so it hasnt been as nearly effective as you think.
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