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In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

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Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#131

Post by volgo »

jadedhacker wrote: post #37
yodon wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I’ve never understood what the employee gets out of it The intelligence services have done a great deal of research into the persona of the press leaker/Wikileaks leaker (as distinct from the more traditional espionage leaker). A common trait is for the press leaker to be either highly over-qualified for their job or believe themselves to be over-qualified for their job. The belief coming out of that research is a s…

I'm a little skeptical. The intelligence services would say something that would make you skeptical of the motivations of leakers. If they're selfishly motivated the public doesn't mind them being locked up and put into isolation and tortured in ways that don't leave a mark. The leakers that come to mind immediately are Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning whom both suffered greatly for their leaks (Snowden had to leav…

I believe that. Anecdotally, I know people from past work experience, the ones who rattle to an outsider (either to another department or to the public) are generally the "frustrated asshole" type with a huge sense of entitlement and god syndrome.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#132

Post by ghaff »

tajen wrote: post #74
foobaw wrote: post #36

This highly contrasts Netflix, which barely has any leaks, although discloses almost all their information to employees. Is it Apple's company size and culture that make leaks inevitable?

Maybe Netflix is a young company with a lot of growth. Maybe Apple has a proportion of disgruntled employees because everyone has been suffering their secrecy for 20 years and some might be upset about their career paths, without being allowed to talk about it. It just takes 10 leakers for a full year of news.

They shipped their first DVD 20 years ago according to the DVD mailer I just received. So they're not that young. (Obviously, video streaming is more recent.)

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#133

Post by ghaff »

MajorSauce wrote: post #17
jsnell wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything after the bolded "Here’s the memo:" is indeed written by Apple. That's kind of the nature of quoting a memo...

TBF, they should have worked the formatting so that it is easier to find for someone looking the said memo without having to scan through the whole article.

And the wording of the memo--quoting people and so forth--reads more like a news story than it does an internal memo. I had to go back through it to realize that the entire bottom section is a memo because memos are typically written in a single person's voice.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#134

Post by tyingq »

yodon wrote: post #14
IBM wrote: post #2

Somewhat ironic that this memo got leaked but I think in this case it actually serves their purpose for it to be read by everyone (including potential employees). I think this part is key and is something I've always wondered about: >While it may seem flattering to be approached, it’s important to remember that you’re getting played. The success of these outsiders is measured by obtaining Apple’s secrets from you and…

>I’ve never understood what the employee gets out of it The intelligence services have done a great deal of research into the persona of the press leaker/Wikileaks leaker (as distinct from the more traditional espionage leaker). A common trait is for the press leaker to be either highly over-qualified for their job or believe themselves to be over-qualified for their job. The belief coming out of that research is a s…

Depends on the leak. Leaking new product info is different from leaking incriminating info. And I'm sure there's lots of grey in between those two extremes. Susan Fowler's motivations seemed pretty pure.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#135

Post by praneshp »

bhhaskin wrote: post #54
praneshp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes the leaker might think they have an upside. I worked (generally, in the same floor/area) with one such person[0]. The actual emails are available for the public, the leaker wanted some coverage for the new startup she was going to move to. [0]: https://www.mercurynews.com/2015/08/18/ex-yahoo-employee-adm...

Man that site is bad. First thing on mobile is a full ad.

I chose it after I tried to google for a better article. The other ones are paywalled[0] or scribd[1]

[0]: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-05-08/yahoo-sue...

[1]: https://www.scribd.com/document/275069641/Yahoo-vs-Cecile-La...

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#136

Post by gaius »

IBM wrote: post #2

Somewhat ironic that this memo got leaked but I think in this case it actually serves their purpose for it to be read by everyone (including potential employees). I think this part is key and is something I've always wondered about: >While it may seem flattering to be approached, it’s important to remember that you’re getting played. The success of these outsiders is measured by obtaining Apple’s secrets from you and…

I've never understood what the employee gets out of it

Revenge against a real or imaginary slight, by senior managers, or even their own line manager.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#137

Post by nosequel »

rdlecler1 wrote: post #126
jadedhacker wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a little skeptical. The intelligence services would say something that would make you skeptical of the motivations of leakers. If they're selfishly motivated the public doesn't mind them being locked up and put into isolation and tortured in ways that don't leave a mark. The leakers that come to mind immediately are Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning whom both suffered greatly for their leaks (Snowden had to leav…

I’d put Snowden in a different camp because he fell on the sword. Would Manning have leave if she thought she would be caught?

Wait what? Snowden never turned himself in. Snowden ran for the hills right into the arms of rival intelligence. Please don't confusing cowardly running with the act of committing suicide by sword to the stomach. Whether you agree with Snowden or not, he still committed a crime and broke a contract he signed and swore to.

Manning at least spent her day in court. Yeah they are different, Snowden was a coward. If he truly did it for the good of the world, he'd turn himself in because of the reward he has already gotten by sharing information he felt like the world needed.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#138

Post by microtherion »

5_minutes wrote: post #51

What I find baffling is the difference in leaks pre and post Jobs era. Perhaps management should look at themselves also why people are leaking now and weren’t before.

> the difference in leaks pre and post Jobs era

There were leaks in the Jobs era, and pretty substantial ones too. Here's a notorious case: https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-settles-with-worker-bee/

> why people are leaking now and weren’t before

This assumes it's the same people. I would not know one way or the other, but my gut feeling is that newer employees are more prone to leaking, and Apple is a lot bigger than it was under Jobs.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#139

Post by rdlecler1 »

nosequel wrote: post #137
rdlecler1 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d put Snowden in a different camp because he fell on the sword. Would Manning have leave if she thought she would be caught?

Wait what? Snowden never turned himself in. Snowden ran for the hills right into the arms of rival intelligence. Please don't confusing cowardly running with the act of committing suicide by sword to the stomach. Whether you agree with Snowden or not, he still committed a crime and broke a contract he signed and swore to. Manning at least spent her day in court. Yeah they are different, Snowden was a coward. If he tr…

Snowden knew he was going to get exposed (and likely caught) and he did it anyway. And I certainly don’t blame him for running. The system was never going to give him a fair shake.

Re: In a Leaked Memo, Apple Warns Employees to Stop Leaking Information

#140

Post by cromwellian »

stouset wrote: post #111
cromwellian wrote: post #88

I think Apple obsesses too much about secrecy and attributes too much of it to its success. Except for the iPhone launch, almost nothing they've launched hasn't been leaked ahead of time, and yet, it is still the most valuable company in the world and their sales are through the roof. It seems they are still pining for that "shock-and-awe" of Steve Jobs original 2007 iPhone introduction, but don't realize that's no w…

There's a huge advantage in your competitors not knowing what your focus is, particularly if you're working on something out of left fields. The more you can hide from them, the more of a head start you can have over them.

Does Apple have a head start on most things they do? Most observers acknowledge they aren't usually the first to do something, rather, they're good at execution and polish. They were beaten to market on pretty much everything: watches, bezelless displays with notch (e.g. Essential Phone), smart/speakers (Amazon, Google, Sonos), Streaming/TV (Roku, Amazon, Chromecast), etc.

Really, I think the world would be better if they published more openly and were more open, and I don't think it would really hurt their ability to outsell their competitors at all. Let's say they're working on AR glasses (which they probably are) and Samsung catches wind of this and rushes to market with Samsung AR glasses. How many Apple fans actually think this will make a difference to people in the Apple ecosystem buying Apple AR glasses?

At this point I think the secrecy does more harm than good.

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