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Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

theguardian.com

61–70 of 80 posts

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#61
post #28
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the UK and know no one who would call McDonalds or Burger King a restaurant. I wouldn't call TGIFriday a restaurant either.

What do you call them?

take-away; fast food places; in a formal setting maybe fast-food restaurant but never restaurant alone.

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#62
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Shit", mostly. I actually can't think of a collective term that I would use for these places. If someone asked what a McDonalds was, I'd honestly probably reply "It's a fast food place that sells shitty burgers"

Yeah, they aren't restaurants, just places where people pay to sit and eat meals that are cooked and served on the premises.

The differences are the presence of a take-away option (which is as popular as the eat-there option), and that there's no waiter service. Nor cutlery.

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fluoride water So... tap water? Most countries add flouride to their tap water because it improves dental health. Unless you're a redneck screaming about alien mind control, that isn't some crazy scary chemical compound. > soy sauce with sodium beonzoate *Sodium Benzoate Again, perfectly boring salt that reduces pH. Not some scary mind control substance, just a salt you can produce at home. > sodium nitrate-laden E…

> > sodium nitrate-laden > Every preserved meat in the world. Also found naturally in Chile. Just because it's common or "natural" doesn't mean it's not bad for you. There are legitimate health concerns about nitrate use in foods.[1][2] >> heats up frozen soup in a plastic bag > Again, most plastics are rated for this. Also helps cut down on glass shards in your food, or badly sanitized cookware giving you the runs.…

> How do you know which plastics

This is regulated by the FDA. See [1] for a link to their hub which goes into far more detail. Obviously a restaurant can violate the regulation, just as they can slip glass shards into your food or not wear gloves.

> Just because it's common or "natural" doesn't mean it's not bad for you

You're correct in this regard at large, see Sharks, Lions and Bears. However nitrates (especially sodium nitrate, not to be confused with potassium nitrate) have been used for a very very very long time in human history for preserving meat. The guardian article is extremely disappointing in that it makes no reference to published material and seems to make several bad claims, including to the reference of salting meat as an "alternative". That being said like all chemicals too much of it will cause adverse side effects, and there are people with genuine reasons (migraines) who want to watch their consumption of it.

> This sort of snark is really not welcome on HN

I'm mostly surprised to see blatantly conspiracy theorist level "there's fluoride in the water man!" kind of nonsense here. It's one thing to discuss your favorite nitrate-free red wine or have a preference on bacon, it's another to suggest that flouridated tap water is a negative.

There was recently a town near me, in Texas, that voted to de-flouridate their water supply. This kind of non-logical fear is backed by comments like this that suggest anything with a vaguely scientific name is bad for you or should be avoided.

We have already seen this happen with vaccines and already kids have died from measles - MEASLES. A disease that should never pop up again in the industrialized world. We shouldn't be wasting resources to convince educated adults in a first world country to get their vaccines, we should be helping to bring life saving basic medicine to everyone.

So yes, that was snarky and sharp. However I don't think it's okay to spew blatantly alarmist non-scientific nonsense and pretend it's "just an opinion". (And sorry for the rather long rant.)

[1] - https://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/Packag...

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#64

Are phthalates bad?

> Researchers investigating levels of phthalates in the human body, which have been linked to asthma, breast cancer, type 2 diabetes and fertility issues in the past few years...

Neither CDC nor Wikipedia show very clear support for this assertion, especially given that the actual levels in the study weren't reported. Just relative percentages.

https://www.cdc.gov/biomonitoring/Phthalates_FactSheet.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phthalate#Health_effects

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm including both corporate chains like TGIF and Chipotle, in addition to: * that sushi restaurant in the strip mall, that serves you rice cooked with fluoride water and soy sauce with sodium beonzoate * that "gourmet" deli that serves you sodium nitrate-laden on top of pesticide- and preservative-laden bread with a yellow #5 pickle. * that coffee shop that pours a hot beverage at 140F/60C into a plastic-lined, plas…

> fluoride water So... tap water? Most countries add flouride to their tap water because it improves dental health. Unless you're a redneck screaming about alien mind control, that isn't some crazy scary chemical compound. > soy sauce with sodium beonzoate *Sodium Benzoate Again, perfectly boring salt that reduces pH. Not some scary mind control substance, just a salt you can produce at home. > sodium nitrate-laden E…

>> fluoride water

> So... tap water? Most countries add flouride to their tap water because it improves dental health. Unless you're a redneck screaming about alien mind control, that isn't some crazy scary chemical compound.

There are legitimate sources [1] today that are questioning the utility of adding fluoride to tap water. Questioning the utility and healthfulness of chemicals added to tap water should not be taboo or related to conspiracy theories.

[1] https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/magazine/magazine_article/fluor...

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Semantics. Restaurant are places where you eat. For most people, restaurants don't have star. In France, they mostly buy their stuff at Metro. That's why I pay more and more money to go to very good restaurant. But I care deeply about food, I love it, I cook, and I have money. That's not the usual situation.

I agree it is semantics, but it shouldn't be in my opinion. While it will never happen, I would prefer to call yourself a restaurant you would need to prove that you had hired qualified chefs and that you were producing all the for you sell. It's a major gripe of the industry that people like me do the work to create real quality food, and then get lumped in with places that use premade crap. I should probably stop m…

Well, now is the perfect opportunity to name your restaurant :)

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fluoride water So... tap water? Most countries add flouride to their tap water because it improves dental health. Unless you're a redneck screaming about alien mind control, that isn't some crazy scary chemical compound. > soy sauce with sodium beonzoate *Sodium Benzoate Again, perfectly boring salt that reduces pH. Not some scary mind control substance, just a salt you can produce at home. > sodium nitrate-laden E…

> > sodium nitrate-laden > Every preserved meat in the world. Also found naturally in Chile. Just because it's common or "natural" doesn't mean it's not bad for you. There are legitimate health concerns about nitrate use in foods.[1][2] >> heats up frozen soup in a plastic bag > Again, most plastics are rated for this. Also helps cut down on glass shards in your food, or badly sanitized cookware giving you the runs.…

Ignoring conspiracy theory gibberish (in this case the fluoridated water rubbish) is MUCH worse than calling it out. You want HN to eventually be populated solely by ‘science proves immunization causes autism’ fruit-cakes? Then keep doing what you’re doing, which is ignoring their lunatic conspiracies and attacking anyone who calls them out with petty sanctimonious appeals to the rules.

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#68
In addition to the issue of relying entirely on correlation, this report only states relative percentage increase without stating absolute levels or comparison to any known risk thresholds. Maybe 35% higher exposure isn't a significantly greater risk.

If it is a significant risk, I don't think I can rest easier only getting two thirds the exposure staying at home. That's still a lot of plastic if I'm actually that close to a toxicity threshold.

Edit: Also, as I noted in another comment, both CDC and Wikipedia are much more conservative about the health impact, making the question about toxicity threshold even more relevant.

https://www.cdc.gov/biomonitoring/Phthalates_FactSheet.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phthalate#Health_effects

Re: Eating out increases levels of phthalates in the body, study finds

#69

In my office, I see seemingly reasonable white-collar employees regularly microwave their lunch in all sorts of flimsy plastic containers. I’m not even shocked anymore.

I think the people who know not to microwave plastic, and don't, are a very small minority. The people who have never heard it are in a slightly larger minority. The people who have heard it's bad, but choose not to heed the warnings for convenience sake, are seemingly the majority.

Most times I've mentioned it to someone who is about to microwave plastic, they say something along the lines of "oh yeah, I've heard that before", as they continue to put their plastic in the microwave and start it up. I've given up on trying to educate people about it.

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