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61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

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Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#21

Post by quickben »

Waterluvian wrote: post #5

Won't the market sort out whatever this is? Is there a specific unfair mechanism at play that would prevent supply and demand from finding its balance?

There is. It's called rent to pay. The employers can out wait the potential employee. My biggest career jumps were when I had a job.

Toronto, Canada: all job offers when I was unemployed were advertised+2k. All job offers while employed were at least 5k over current salary (and up to 20k).

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#22

Post by apsec112 »

chroem- wrote: post #9
Waterluvian wrote: post #5

Won't the market sort out whatever this is? Is there a specific unfair mechanism at play that would prevent supply and demand from finding its balance?

The fact that people need a source of income to live, and that they have very little influence on the price of their labor without collective bargaining.

People also need food to live, and they have no influence on the price of food; you can't go into Safeway and get a prime steak for $1.50. Yet there is such an abundance of food at such low prices that half of Westerners are overweight. The labor market must have other issues, besides these, if it's having more problems than the food market.

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#23

Post by itg »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #2

I get it though. The employer is thinking: Why do I pay you to train you? You should pay me to train you. Lets bring back the apprentice system.

That's sort of what internships are for, but those often restricted to people studying in college, and I've even seen internship applications ask for experience in X,Y, and Z technology.

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#24

Post by nradov »

bcheung wrote: post #12
crimsonalucard wrote: post #2

I get it though. The employer is thinking: Why do I pay you to train you? You should pay me to train you. Lets bring back the apprentice system.

I've said the same thing myself about bringing back the apprenticeship system. That system required a contract of typically 7 years though and that is why masters would take on apprentices. 7 years is a long time but if there is a way to have your investment not just walk out the door after you spent a bunch of resources getting them up to speed that would make it much more feasible. Perhaps a forgivable loan upon co…

Employers can already offer forgivable loans to pay for employee training. One of my former employers handled tuition reimbursement for my Master's degree that way. After I graduated and stayed two more years they wrote off the debt. (I did have to pay income tax on the forgiven debt though.)

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#25

Post by paulie_a »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #2

I get it though. The employer is thinking: Why do I pay you to train you? You should pay me to train you. Lets bring back the apprentice system.

That is amazingly short sighted by an employer. They don't deserve to have an employee they can train.

A company is losing the opportunity to train employees. And if they don't put the effort in early.. They are probably losing their top talent and don't even realize it.

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#27

Post by jamestimmins »

The buried lede here seems to be "In real life, folks need to apply to 150-250 jobs to get a job".

I'd be so, so interested to see the breakdown here, and what causes these types of numbers. Are there just enormous numbers of applicants for every job? Are people applying for jobs they aren't qualified for? How does this compare in tech vs the rest of the job market?

The signal/noise ratio must be absurdly low if this is possible.

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#28

Post by crankylinuxuser »

This also sounds like a great way to cut out "undesirables". The women can be 'given' social roles and kept out of the tech areas, and minorities are never allowed the 3 years experience.

Yeah, its jaded. I've been around the block a few times. Of course nobody outright says these things. They never really have to. The policies enforce those decisions.

Re: 61% of “Entry-Level” Jobs Require 3+ Years of Experience

#29

Post by phinnaeus »

meaydinli wrote: post #20
williamscales wrote: post #15

If you go to college and do an internship or research fellowship each summer, you will come out with "3 years" of experience.

Is it not mandatory for engineering/CS? I had to do 2 internships for my bachelors, and 1 for my masters.

I did one internship.
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