Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

rollingstone.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 75 posts

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#31

Post by wallawe »

lsaferite wrote: post #28
sageabilly wrote: post #24

One of the things this article doesn't touch on is the very deep roots of hog farming in rural NC and the general prevailing attitude of "This is how we've always done it and I don't want no gubment telling me what I can and can't do with my land!" There is a sense of pride in being a hog farmer like your daddy and your granpappy and your uncle and you hope to pass down those roots to your sons some day. As to why th…

I'll not argue the point you are making as I don't disagree. I would just like to say I find it highly annoying when people denigrate people from the south by using 'words' like 'gubment' and 'granpappy' as some sort of assumed indicator of intelligence level of the subject being discussed. You being from NC and using this same backhanded insult troubles me even more TBH. Do people from the south use those words, or…

100% agree. It's become so commonplace to stereotype southerners in a particular way in the media and by Hollywood. I live in NYC now and have to deal with constant judgement whenever I mention I'm from Alabama. The most ironic thing is that it's typically from the "tolerant" left.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#32

Post by DataWorker »

lsaferite wrote: post #28
sageabilly wrote: post #24

One of the things this article doesn't touch on is the very deep roots of hog farming in rural NC and the general prevailing attitude of "This is how we've always done it and I don't want no gubment telling me what I can and can't do with my land!" There is a sense of pride in being a hog farmer like your daddy and your granpappy and your uncle and you hope to pass down those roots to your sons some day. As to why th…

I'll not argue the point you are making as I don't disagree. I would just like to say I find it highly annoying when people denigrate people from the south by using 'words' like 'gubment' and 'granpappy' as some sort of assumed indicator of intelligence level of the subject being discussed. You being from NC and using this same backhanded insult troubles me even more TBH. Do people from the south use those words, or…

Thanks for making this point. People who would never even consider mocking the speech patterns of immigrants will fall all over themselves to denigrate southerners, thier speech and deplorable, to some, religious beliefs.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#34

Post by moate »

mido22 wrote: post #17
moate wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but the idea of "developing economies" is an actual thing in economic theory. And what the industries are doing is being exploitative in the same way that many nations use globalization as a way to exploit poorer, less established economic players. There are nations who came to the globalization table later or who haven't put together an economic plan that provides a high quality of living for their citizens. W…

so you are saying USA provides high quality standard of living for all it's citizens?

let's just walk right past THAT straw man and get to the meat of the issue: "Developing nation" as a slur.

The World Bank has said that "developing/developed" duality isn't fitting anymore and now breaks nations into 4 catagories: Low, Lower Middle, Upper Middle, and High income nations based on citizen income. The UN says that there's no specific metrics for a Developed vs Developing nation, and uses the terms for convenience.

There's no set specific definition of what a developing nation is, but generally it's assumed that the types of things I mentioned in my last post (higher quality of life, more money, as well as higher life expectancy, lower birth rate) are associated with Developed nations. MOST people agree these things are good, and MOST people assume that the absence of them is therefor bad.

The point of the title of the article is that deregulation has allowed a Developed nation to contain pockets that look more like a less developed country with less regulation, more exploitative labor, lower overall income, and little regard for the health of its citizens. A quick way to say that would be that it looks more like a developing nation.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#35

Post by bluthru »

fny wrote: post #3
Dirlewanger wrote: post #2

Globalization: it works both ways! We can exploit rural Chinese and they can exploit rural Americans.

Exploitation? I thought this was the miracle of an unregulated free market uplifting people from economic depravity. Also the article does eventually make your point, but it's unfortunately buried in the conclusion: > American economic philosophy has long centered on the idea that deregulation is good for businesses, whose growth will provide jobs and prosperity, which will make America strong. But that thinking was…

>But that thinking was based on the assumption that we would always be holding the big end of the globalization stick.

"We" being owners, not workers: https://hbr.org/resources/images/article_assets/2016/05/W160...

If fossil fuel was priced accurately (with regard to its harm) this might have never been an issue.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#36

Post by seanmcdirmid »

wallawe wrote: post #31
lsaferite wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll not argue the point you are making as I don't disagree. I would just like to say I find it highly annoying when people denigrate people from the south by using 'words' like 'gubment' and 'granpappy' as some sort of assumed indicator of intelligence level of the subject being discussed. You being from NC and using this same backhanded insult troubles me even more TBH. Do people from the south use those words, or…

100% agree. It's become so commonplace to stereotype southerners in a particular way in the media and by Hollywood. I live in NYC now and have to deal with constant judgement whenever I mention I'm from Alabama. The most ironic thing is that it's typically from the "tolerant" left.

When I lived in Vicksburg Mississippi, I got a lot of flack for my weird yankee (actually neutral midwestern) accent as well as typical northern stereotypes (and I’m a westerner, not even a real yankee). I guess you could say that should be expected from the less tolerant right, but it definitely goes both ways.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#37

Post by kurthr »

sageabilly wrote: post #24

One of the things this article doesn't touch on is the very deep roots of hog farming in rural NC and the general prevailing attitude of "This is how we've always done it and I don't want no gubment telling me what I can and can't do with my land!" There is a sense of pride in being a hog farmer like your daddy and your granpappy and your uncle and you hope to pass down those roots to your sons some day. As to why th…

The words you're looking for are, "smells like money".

The wealthy/corps who distribute/buy don't care because they don't live there... working farmers know nothing else that will keep their family on the middleclass treadmill (education is right out) without the externalities of stench and pollution, while the working poor (closest to the animals and carcasses) couldn't find another job without uprooting their extended family.

It's a simple living that most communities couldn't stomach. One day there will be a virus or bacteria that will wipe it out, but until then you won't take away their lifestyle. It's all they know.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#38

Post by lsaferite »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #36
wallawe wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% agree. It's become so commonplace to stereotype southerners in a particular way in the media and by Hollywood. I live in NYC now and have to deal with constant judgement whenever I mention I'm from Alabama. The most ironic thing is that it's typically from the "tolerant" left.

When I lived in Vicksburg Mississippi, I got a lot of flack for my weird yankee (actually neutral midwestern) accent as well as typical northern stereotypes (and I’m a westerner, not even a real yankee). I guess you could say that should be expected from the less tolerant right, but it definitely goes both ways.

Growing up in the south and not having a southern accent was REAL fun in school. Kids are evil.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#39

Post by wallawe »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #36
wallawe wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% agree. It's become so commonplace to stereotype southerners in a particular way in the media and by Hollywood. I live in NYC now and have to deal with constant judgement whenever I mention I'm from Alabama. The most ironic thing is that it's typically from the "tolerant" left.

When I lived in Vicksburg Mississippi, I got a lot of flack for my weird yankee (actually neutral midwestern) accent as well as typical northern stereotypes (and I’m a westerner, not even a real yankee). I guess you could say that should be expected from the less tolerant right, but it definitely goes both ways.

I went to school at All-Saints there in Vicksburg, small world! Yes, there is definitely a stereotype in the south towards yankees (which is pretty much anyone not from the south as you alluded). I just expected more from highly educated folks with a wider world view in NYC.

Re: Lax regulation made it cheaper for China to outsource pork production to the US

#40

Post by Clubber »

readhn wrote: post #15
moate wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh man, you had a great point until you went off and decided to become a self-righteous douche at the end there. Just couldn't stick the dismount... To your point: I think the better mechanism isn't taxation, but regulation/fines. And there was regulation in place, but one of the points of the articles is that government officials in these areas 1- tend to be controlled by these massive industries and 2- push legisla…

Fines do not work. Look at the banking sector: HSBC, JP etc. they get slapped with fines all the time but continue business as usual. Heavy taxation is a very quick way to make these types of socially and environmentally polluting business to change or to go away all together.

Fines do work, but they have to hurt. If people only got fined $1.00 for speeding rather than the usual $300, there'd be a hell of a lot more speeders. With the banks and investment institutions, the fines are typically only a small percentage of what the net of the move was. ($1.00 vs $300).

Of course fines, only work so much. People still used drugs during the 80s and 90s when punishment was over the top (and still is).

Post reply on HN