Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media • Hacker News Board

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#51

Post by sfuller808 » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 8:07 PM UTC

Zhyl wrote: post #22

packet_nerd wrote: post #17

> "...the development of open social protocols that support the network effect usefulness of large social networks without a centralized company in charge." Not sure what exact shape the author imagines this might take, but I've had this idea (dream) in the back of my mind for a long time.. We need a standardized protocol that is open (I.E. not controlled by or dependent on 1 or 2 companies), private and secure by de…

I think we need to think of social protocols less as a technical solution and more as what I'd describe in my day job as a 'business process'. Sure, part of this will be tech-enabled and parts will be fully automated, but I feel that what is really lacking is an internet etiquette that can be abstracted over different channels or platforms. Consider Facebook. With the friend request it invented a new social protocol…

i feel like https://webfinger.net/ provides some of the technical side of the 'business process'

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#52

Post by andrewshadura » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 8:18 PM UTC

Zhyl wrote: post #22

packet_nerd wrote: post #17

> "...the development of open social protocols that support the network effect usefulness of large social networks without a centralized company in charge." Not sure what exact shape the author imagines this might take, but I've had this idea (dream) in the back of my mind for a long time.. We need a standardized protocol that is open (I.E. not controlled by or dependent on 1 or 2 companies), private and secure by de…

I think we need to think of social protocols less as a technical solution and more as what I'd describe in my day job as a 'business process'. Sure, part of this will be tech-enabled and parts will be fully automated, but I feel that what is really lacking is an internet etiquette that can be abstracted over different channels or platforms. Consider Facebook. With the friend request it invented a new social protocol…

Only that the concept of a friend and a friend request existed before Facebook.

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#53

Post by walterbell » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 8:19 PM UTC

EGreg wrote: post #25

If I may shamelessly mention the project we've been working on the last 7 years... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ1O_gmPneI 1. We started with the idea that actually social tools would let you get in, get out and get on with life. They would help you coordinate your actual social life in the real world instead of sucking up your time online. A minute spent on the app would result in hours socializing in the real wor…

Nice work. Which tool did you use to create the video?

One of the examples says that when overlaying a Google map widget on the dentist's site, that the dentist does not have access to location data. Elsewhere, the video mentions iframes. If the dentist's web site runs HTTPS, how are you injecting iframes? Or is the primary "site" being served locally, with the dentist's web site displayed in an iframe?

If all of the user's identity data is stored on their phone, how do they backup that data or move it between devices?

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#54

Post by kerrsclyde » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 8:25 PM UTC

eitland wrote: post #16

otachack wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you looked at static page generators? Wonder if that provides the simplicity you're looking for along with optional customization. One example: https://gohugo.io

Did. Got distracted by choosing one. Got distracted by choosing a template. Got distracted by problems with Markdown (an8d Asciidoc). Get distracted every time I want to write. After I got my html "template" up and running I just copy that and write whatever I want to write. Conclusion: for me, when writing, finding the correct tools prevented me from just writing. (I have however spend some time on my developer tool…

Amen to this.

I've spent more time than I dare to admit trying to rebuild my person web site which I ran successfully from 2000-2012. Which coding framework should I use, CSS, database, hosting platform, the list goes on. I should have just spent the time writing it all in plain vanilla html (which I've now started doing).

Ironically if I'd start posting my content on a social network where I had no control over how it looked/functioned I would have spent my time actually putting together something useful.

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#55

Post by EGreg » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 8:59 PM UTC

walterbell wrote: post #53

EGreg wrote: post #25

If I may shamelessly mention the project we've been working on the last 7 years... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ1O_gmPneI 1. We started with the idea that actually social tools would let you get in, get out and get on with life. They would help you coordinate your actual social life in the real world instead of sucking up your time online. A minute spent on the app would result in hours socializing in the real wor…

Nice work. Which tool did you use to create the video? One of the examples says that when overlaying a Google map widget on the dentist's site, that the dentist does not have access to location data. Elsewhere, the video mentions iframes. If the dentist's web site runs HTTPS, how are you injecting iframes? Or is the primary "site" being served locally, with the dentist's web site displayed in an iframe? If all of the…

Great questions.

1. I used Keynote and then ScreenFlow

2. The dentist's site HTML/JS actually chooses to include the iframe pointing to the user's identity server, our platform does the rest.

3. The user's data is stored encrypted in other areas, as well. They themselves can decrypt the data and grant keys to access it as they see fit. Our platform handles the rest.

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#56

Post by walterbell » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 9:03 PM UTC

intopieces wrote: post #50

bogomipz wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"The problem with the idea of going back to a distributed internet is that it directly contradicts the primary thing people in the #DeleteFacebook rant about: Privacy." Can you elaborate on how exactly maintaining your own site/blog/domain/presence etc is at odds with privacy advocation? Content control, copyright and DRM are orthogonal to the issue of privacy. Also I don't really understand the use of the phrase "t…

>Can you elaborate on how exactly maintaining your own site/blog/domain/presence etc is at odds with privacy advocation? A website that any old person can access means it's a website that any number of bots can crawl over and aggregate. Now you're basically back where we started with Facebook.

There's a big difference between content aggregation (done by all search engines) and behavioral profiling (done by advertising companies, including social media).

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#57

Post by superkuh » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 9:21 PM UTC

otachack wrote: post #12

eitland wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently created a web site. Just black text on white background. I write about stuff I find interesting. So far a few unfinished pages. I don't even think it is indexed yet. It is my rebellion against pixel perfect audience building technical blogging and what not. It feels good. I might add links to other similar pages at some point. Anyone else makes old fashioned web sites?

Have you looked at static page generators? Wonder if that provides the simplicity you're looking for along with optional customization. One example: https://gohugo.io

Server side includes. It does everything required and doesn't bloat and doesn't change. I've been using them since the geocities era with hand-written static html content. Easy to mix and match.

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#58

Post by mgiannopoulos » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 10:05 PM UTC

jancsika wrote: post #21

> For those who don’t crave recognition, it induces a digital life that’s more localized to closer friends and family — a state that’s more congruent with our fundamental human instincts. It's a noble goal. To achieve it, the author suggests that people buy a domain name, spend $4 a month on web hosting, and manually install Wordpress. The author leaves out ssl, so I assume either the person is going to pay some more…

One can also use WordPress.com and an owner domain. Hosting, installation and security is covered and you still get to own your content. And I haven’t heard of any pro-Tibetan blogs banned from WordPress.com

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#59

Post by aaavl2821 » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 10:22 PM UTC

bogomipz wrote: post #13

I thought this was a well-written piece. I would love to see a "return to the internet" movement in 2018. The author suggests everyone "acquire your own damn digital land." And I think this is the way forward. In 2005 or the pre-FB era being a "techie" was a personal distinction. I feel that now most people have become "techies" in varying degrees, either out of necessity or general interest. I mention this because I…

I am not an engineer but also am not a huge social media fan -- I like more control over what i share and the format I use to share it. Instead of using linked in / FB pages / medium, I've been building personal websites for friends and my own businesses, first using Wordpress, but found that just making simple static sites is much easier for me and more flexible.

However, Ive had trouble with super basic deployment stuff and i haven't found many resources to help. Ive just been using Cpanel, manual ftp updates, shared hosting etc, but have found this setup is super limiting, and I didn't really know much about hosting options before setting hosting up

I just found netlify, which seems great: integration with github, easy ssl certs, free, but just changing the DNS to point to netlify has been confusing, and I haven't been able to fix it. I also setup a site for a friend who was using wix (so terrible...) and can't figure out how to get hosting switched.

I feel stupid for not being able to do this, and have been able to figure out how to do a lot of stuff that should be more complex (building web apps, data analysis with Python, etc) but I've struggled with basics of deployment

A good set of resources for people who aren't engineers but have some HTML / CSS and programming knowledge, but don't have any devops or professional engineering background would be really useful imo

Re: Thoughts on Embracing the Social Internet Over Social Media

#60

Post by intopieces » Sun, Mar 25, 2018, 10:36 PM UTC

walterbell wrote: post #56

intopieces wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Can you elaborate on how exactly maintaining your own site/blog/domain/presence etc is at odds with privacy advocation? A website that any old person can access means it's a website that any number of bots can crawl over and aggregate. Now you're basically back where we started with Facebook.

There's a big difference between content aggregation (done by all search engines) and behavioral profiling (done by advertising companies, including social media).

Sure, but that fact that the latter is supposedly not done on personal web pages doesn't mean it can't / won't be done on the data on, say, Mastodon instances.