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Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

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Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#201

Post by emilecantin »

briandear wrote: post #92
masklinn wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That only works where the government is willing though, see Australia for a case study of the opposite. And keep in mind that in France currently "fiber" means "at least FFTN", much of rural france won't see FTTH for a long time.

Exactly. Fiber to the home is the only fiber than really matters. If there is fiber but my last mile is old copper, then that doesn’t do me a lot of good does it? France claiming 100% fiber by 2022? They are dreaming, or perhaps even delusional. No way they can get FTTH by 2022. There are some places that don’t have any connectivity and you have to use Satelite. They’re going to fix that in 4 years?

It depends on what kind of copper. DSL suffers from the limits of twisted pairs over medium-long distances, with only about 1100 kHz available. DOCSIS, with its shielded coaxial cable, has much higher bandwidth available, up to 750 MHz.

In practical terms, this means that DSL has already reached its practical limit with speeds around 30-50 Mbps, whereas Cable Internet still has room to grow around 2-4 Gbps, depending on how many TV channels the operator is ready to sacrifice to Internet traffic.

Of course, this doesn't address congestion / oversubscription issues around cable, but assuming a competently managed network, FTTN with coax as the last mile is still a very good choice in 2018.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#202

Post by username223 »

conanbatt wrote: post #179
ipsin wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"launching cars into space" is a reference to the recent launch of a Tesla into space. https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/6/16983744/spacex-tesla-falc...

I know that, but to the detriment of society?

I don't completely agree with this argument, but...

All of that money came from somewhere. Do you wonder why most of your local retailers went out of business, and you can't visit a local bookstore or camera shop anymore? It's related to why Jeff Bezos has so much money that he has nothing better to do than shoot stuff into space. Preferably, he will shoot bigger stuff farther than Elon Musk, Richard Branson, or Paul Allen.

It could also be used somewhere else. Is shooting suicidal volunteers at Mars really the best use of billions of dollars?

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#203

Post by [deleted] »

apeace wrote: post #175

As you can surmise by reading this article, the rise of the wireless ISPs (or WISPs) is not because the wireless technology is better or drastically cheaper. It's because in so many places, the incumbents are able to prevent you from building out fiber. They simply haven't developed the weapons to destroy the WISPs yet, but unless the political climate in states/cities changes, they will. It is tough for WISPs to com…

[deleted]

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#204

Post by jeffreyrogers »

rainbowmverse wrote: post #188
jeffreyrogers wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but why would you assume Tesla is going to be better at making batteries than the companies that have done it for years?

I'm not assuming that.

Sorry, I meant a hypothetical "you". Should have written "why would one assume" instead.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#205

Post by jclardy »

sf_rob wrote: post #187
EA wrote: post #152

Our city just built a fiber network and GF was the first to offer service. Since they have come to town, ATT has installed their own fiber network in our neighborhood and Comcast has increased their speeds. I consider our local area disrupted. And I feel no matter what happens with GF, we’ll have faster internet from now on. BTW: cut the cord. GF 1Gb plan with DirecTV Now and YouTube TV.

Unfortunately disruption is a temporary state. Hopefully the existing incumbents will continue to provide enough competition in your area to keep each other in check.

I feel like it would be very difficult for them to dial back. In my area the same thing occurred. Google Fiber was announced, and suddenly AT&T had fiber to home options available. Then spectrum magically increased their available speeds.

If one of them dials down their service levels, users will just swap to the other. They would have to be concerted in their service downgrades if they didn't want to lose customers.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#206

Post by gamblor956 »

talmand wrote: post #191
rayiner wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We" (the government) didn't build it or pay for it. Even back in the AT&T monopoly era it was always private infrastructure.[1] AT&T got certain rights ( e.g. easements) but that also came with a lot of strings attached (they had to build in a bunch of rural places they never would've built otherwise). Public ownership of the wires was never part of the bargain. [1] The same is true for power lines. They're mostly p…

I would wonder if the subsidies and tax breaks that have been given over to these companies by the government over the years would count towards the idea us having paid for it. There's always that scandal from decades ago that comes up from time-to-time.

Companies were not given subsidies or tax breaks to pay for telephone or power lines. They were allowed to have local monopolies, in exchange for the requirement they provide utility services to all customers in the area, without regard to the cost of building out service to those customers.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#207

Post by phjesusthatguy3 »

airstrike wrote: post #176
scott00 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was most likely referring to the proper noun "Spectrum", rather than the common noun "spectrum". It's a cable tv/internet company owned by Charter.

FKA Time Warner Cable

FWIW Charter was transitioning to the name Spectrum before the purchase of TWC.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#208

Post by knowaveragejoe »

Maybe it's because I live in a wealthier and more dense metropolitan area where there is actually still some semblance of competition between them, but over that same time period both major ISPs in the area have stepped up the speeds they offer and prices haven't risen to match(as far as I can tell). Their lowest tier service is 50mbit, which was just a few years ago one of the highest. Both are offering gigabit to the home now, and one offers 2 gigabit in certain areas.

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#209

Post by [deleted] »

jclardy wrote: post #205
sf_rob wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately disruption is a temporary state. Hopefully the existing incumbents will continue to provide enough competition in your area to keep each other in check.

I feel like it would be very difficult for them to dial back. In my area the same thing occurred. Google Fiber was announced, and suddenly AT&T had fiber to home options available. Then spectrum magically increased their available speeds. If one of them dials down their service levels, users will just swap to the other. They would have to be concerted in their service downgrades if they didn't want to lose customers.

[deleted]

Re: Eight Years On, Google Fiber Is a Faint Echo of the Disruption Promised

#210

Post by username223 »

kbenson wrote: post #172
sideband wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could say that Google Fiber was a response to Comcast's announcement of its intent to acquire NBC in December 2009. Google makes no money if they can't show ads to people, and at the time Comcast and friends controlled Google's access to a majority of US audiences that Google's customers (advertisers) wanted their ads in front of. Advertising in the US was more than half of Google's revenue then. Comcast had the…

> Google makes no money if they can't show ads to people I'm really, really hoping that changes drastically in the next decade. It would be really nice if Google started making the majority of their money from compute cloud offerings (a little out there, but that sector is growing much faster than their general business). I think it's essential if Google's ever going to gain some independence from the perverse incent…

Fundamentally, both Google and Facebook live by questionable morals: Google is a surveillance company trying to branch out, while Facebook is a surveillance and behavioral manipulation company doubling down. Google has some smart engineers, who could maybe make a viable version of the 60s mainframe business when the ad bubble pops. Facebook... I'd pay a couple bucks a month to keep up with acquaintances in a way that's easier than an email list or private Usenet group. But I see them taking the dark path and e.g. selling "consumer profiles" that aren't "credit reports," because "credit reports" are governed by laws.
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