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China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

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Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#71

Post by yusuke10 »

phyller wrote: post #48
cornholio wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One should asume "pro-China" means against dictatorship and presidents for life, right? There is no people or culture on Earth that stands to gain from oligarchy.

I'm an American, I've had many close Chinese friends. What follows is completely anecdotal, but I've spent a lot of time trying to wrap my mind around it, for what it is worth. Our cultures are incredibly different. At the same time our cultures are both unusually strong. And for some reason, part of American culture seems to be assuming everyone in the world is just like us, just in different circumstances. This is…

Alot of the opposite is true. Alot of the Chinese old timers remember the brutality they suffered under Mao and are very upset at this current event. Many of them want to sell their factories and move the money to HK (and eventually out of China).

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#72

Post by phyller »

jakecrouch wrote: post #62

This is why the US should not worry about China as a long-term economic threat - authoritarianism has never worked. The Soviet Union, 1930s Germany and Italy, all collapsed. I think the Chinese realize this and are pessemistic about their own future. The Constitution was designed to make the US Government as weak as possible, because a strong government ultimately turns on its people.

The US has been an instrumental part of a system where we all benefit when others are successful, it is not a zero-sum game. China's economic success is good for America. What is not good for an America is a new xenophobic super power that doesn't share our values.

A stable, prosperous, democratic China is ideal. An easy way for an authoritarian government to keep internal dissent down is to make an external enemy. Think of all the examples you mentioned. So this is probably bad news for the U.S. and the whole world.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#73

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

ilamont wrote: post #39
woolvalley wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China was already an authoritarian nation, how much of an effective difference would this make?

When strongman-based cults of personality (real or wannabe) appoint themselves ruler for life, policy can go off the rails. Wars, purges, persecution of minority groups, and civil unrest are more likely. Corrupt systems of checks and balances, which may have already been weak, slide ever further. Mao, Stalin, Chavez, Castro, Hitler, Mussolini, Chiang Kai-Shek ... a few of these strongmen presided over brief periods o…

And then there's Singapore. Ruled by an authoritarian, gum hating despot who provides nice civic infrastructure for the populace.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#74

Post by tonylinn80 »

cornholio wrote: post #45
tonylinn80 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd be surprised how many people in China are seriously pro-amendment, and agrees that Xi should have a 3rd term or more. Though it's probably also true that tons of people are shocked by the news

I've looked a bit in your posting history and can't say with confidence that you are shill, but a certain patern is clearly emerging: the Chinese government is always right, it serves the people and listens to them, in fact it knows what people want; there is certainly no need for those pesky elections and wasted energy voting. Oligarchy ad infinitum. In the off chance that you are a real person, I'm sorry to say but…

lol, it's not a long history anyway. I'm glad you read. I came to read tech news mostly and didn't feel the need to create an account to post comment until a few days ago

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#75

Post by seanmcdirmid »

backspin wrote: post #66
phyller wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an American, I've had many close Chinese friends. What follows is completely anecdotal, but I've spent a lot of time trying to wrap my mind around it, for what it is worth. Our cultures are incredibly different. At the same time our cultures are both unusually strong. And for some reason, part of American culture seems to be assuming everyone in the world is just like us, just in different circumstances. This is…

This. At least in my family most of my older Chinese relatives prefer order and peace to American democracy, for their income increased dramatically over the past 5 years. But I guess after family income gets to certain threshold, people will start weighting more on freedom.

But if you get to any Chinese over 60, they still remember the chaotic cultural revolution very clearly, they definitely don’t want a return to strongman cult of personality Maoism where Xi seems to be going.

Xi is the last vestige of Maoism, the last president who grew up under Mao’s shadow. The next generation of leadership is surely going to be much more modern than any before it. That they are delaying it for something in china’s past is a travesty.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#77

Post by balthasar »

ilamont wrote: post #39
woolvalley wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China was already an authoritarian nation, how much of an effective difference would this make?

When strongman-based cults of personality (real or wannabe) appoint themselves ruler for life, policy can go off the rails. Wars, purges, persecution of minority groups, and civil unrest are more likely. Corrupt systems of checks and balances, which may have already been weak, slide ever further. Mao, Stalin, Chavez, Castro, Hitler, Mussolini, Chiang Kai-Shek ... a few of these strongmen presided over brief periods o…

Typo there with Chavez? Democratically elected and rose the quality of life of Venezuela.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#78

Post by etrevino »

jakecrouch wrote: post #62

This is why the US should not worry about China as a long-term economic threat - authoritarianism has never worked. The Soviet Union, 1930s Germany and Italy, all collapsed. I think the Chinese realize this and are pessemistic about their own future. The Constitution was designed to make the US Government as weak as possible, because a strong government ultimately turns on its people.

I'm not sure why you say this. Germany and Italy didn't collapse-- they were conquered. The Soviet Union did collapse, it's true, but it collapsed because of external pressures and sclerotic bureaucracy causing an inability to adjust to internal problems. In all three cases there was an external force contributing to the problem. However, there's no reason to assume that China's authoritarian rule will collapse as well. Indeed, in several Soviet successor states (including Russia), authoritarianism has reasserted itself.

Authoritarianism is easy to impose and democracy is fragile; the civic discourse required for a strong and stable democracy relies upon a considerable amount of mutual respect and rhetorical restraint.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#79

Post by [deleted] »

phyller wrote: post #28

It's amazing to me how China is so effectively creating a 1984-type situation without much stir among the rest of the world. These chat programs are super important for everyday life in China. The same company that provides chatting also provides your ability to pay for everything, and a credit score that determines what you can buy, how much you pay, and more. So if you say something you shouldn't, this could very e…

[deleted]

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#80

Post by backspin »

yusuke10 wrote: post #71
phyller wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an American, I've had many close Chinese friends. What follows is completely anecdotal, but I've spent a lot of time trying to wrap my mind around it, for what it is worth. Our cultures are incredibly different. At the same time our cultures are both unusually strong. And for some reason, part of American culture seems to be assuming everyone in the world is just like us, just in different circumstances. This is…

Alot of the opposite is true. Alot of the Chinese old timers remember the brutality they suffered under Mao and are very upset at this current event. Many of them want to sell their factories and move the money to HK (and eventually out of China).

See the difference is you are talking about people who own a factory, but in old days, the majority is those who were short on food and supplies.
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