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Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

reuters.com

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Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#121

Post by epanchin »

albertgoeswoof wrote: post #44

I am so confused by government policy here in the UK. Right now I'm looking at a 5 year old used Diesel car with £0 road tax and 70+ MPG for about 10k GBP. My current Petrol engine costs £130/annum road tax, and only gets 30-40 MPG, I can also buy petrol cars with road tax of £240-500/annum (based on emissions) But if I buy the Diesel, it could be banned or worthless in a few years, because of these types of policies…

Government policy is to not retroactively change tax bands but to control vehicle use through other means, eg emissions zones.

I’m sure you can work out the morally correct action based on the types of areas you drive through. You don’t really need the government to make this decision for you.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#122

Post by tjansen »

noelwelsh wrote: post #114
TomMarius wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So let's take a different approach: Let's find a better solution for individual transportation that doesn't require human labor (e.g. pedaling) and offers the same benefits (ability to comfortably make 500 km per working day, for example - that's average daily mileage of a taxi driver).

You seem very much in favour of cars, but also imagining that cities without cars would look much like cities with cars. Huge amounts of land are given over to roads and parking. Get rid of these and you have much denser cities without decreasing usable space per inhabitant.

I assume you're talking about US cities. Because IMHO most European cities are already far too dense. You can hardly see the sky.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#123

Post by igravious »

TheLostOne wrote: post #110
igravious wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll take either bet. €1000 says the German economy will not crash in the next 5 years due to the mass replacement of people by AI. Another €1000 says that the transition to electric vehicles will not crash the German vehicle industry. (I've changed your wording from cars to vehicles because I do not see the point of the needless restriction.) Let's say as well if the same person wins both bets they get a bonus €1000…

You have a gambling problem? HN is surely not the right place for seeking help, they [1] will help [1] https://www.ncpgambling.org/help-treatment/national-helpline...

I never gamble. Effectively what I'm saying is: polite way–"I'm so confident you're spouting rubbish that I'm will to risk €3000 of my money to prove you wrong even though I never gamble." less polite way–"Put up or shut up."

Also I'm from a neighbouring (check out how I spell neighbour for a clue!) EU country so a link to a US gambling site is no use to me. ;-)

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#124

Post by biswaroop »

tjansen wrote: post #119
TheLostOne wrote: post #45

As a German who never owned a car (have driver license 30+ years) and never will, hurray! Next: Petrol cars please. Costs for cities would decrease a lot [1], room for bicycles would increase, noise would drop to a level which can't believed, ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on and air would be wonderful. [1] https://www.amazon.de/High-Cost-Free-Parking/dp/193236…

Please no bicylces, they are terrible for pedestrians. I'd rather deal with cars than bikes.

Um, cars kill astronomically more pedestrians than do bikes.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#125

Post by 1337biz »

TheLostOne wrote: post #45

As a German who never owned a car (have driver license 30+ years) and never will, hurray! Next: Petrol cars please. Costs for cities would decrease a lot [1], room for bicycles would increase, noise would drop to a level which can't believed, ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on and air would be wonderful. [1] https://www.amazon.de/High-Cost-Free-Parking/dp/193236…

What do you think about the idea that this is a hidden stimulation for the German car industry, ie. If you can find a reason to ban all cars that are painted blue, you create massive demands for other colors.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#126

Post by harperlee »

TheLostOne wrote: post #45

As a German who never owned a car (have driver license 30+ years) and never will, hurray! Next: Petrol cars please. Costs for cities would decrease a lot [1], room for bicycles would increase, noise would drop to a level which can't believed, ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on and air would be wonderful. [1] https://www.amazon.de/High-Cost-Free-Parking/dp/193236…

> ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on

German ambulances and firetrucks have an unbelievable siren volume! It is piercing - I have to literally cover my ears if I'm a bystander. I have never heard anything like that in other European countries or the US. So I suspect that you can already lower their volume if you German people were willing to, seeing that it works fine in other places...

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#127

Post by noelwelsh »

tjansen wrote: post #122
noelwelsh wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem very much in favour of cars, but also imagining that cities without cars would look much like cities with cars. Huge amounts of land are given over to roads and parking. Get rid of these and you have much denser cities without decreasing usable space per inhabitant.

I assume you're talking about US cities. Because IMHO most European cities are already far too dense. You can hardly see the sky.

All cities with cars, and no, they aren't.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#128

Post by [deleted] »

CalRobert wrote: post #106
agmcleod wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In many cases I see cycling ruin life if you enjoy driving or walking ;). I do find places that i've seen be bike friendly in Europe do a much better job at this. But cyclists in Toronto can be pretty awful. Likewise can pedestrians and cars. Whichever way I travel, the other two are annoying me or causing me grief somehow.

Some people are inconsiderate :-( . Some of those people ride bikes. I've been annoyed at bicyclists while walking along holding my helmet just after docking my Dublinbike, even. But a jerk walking is virtually certainly not going to kill me (or my kid). A jerk cycling almost certainly won't either. But a jerk driving quite possibly will - after all, where I come from there's a 9/11 on the roads every month due to dr…

[deleted]

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#129

Post by tjansen »

biswaroop wrote: post #124
tjansen wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please no bicylces, they are terrible for pedestrians. I'd rather deal with cars than bikes.

Um, cars kill astronomically more pedestrians than do bikes.

There are two differences: a) It's something that I can control, as long as I stay on the sidewalk and the cars stay on the street. But I have no control over bicycles on the sidewalks (even if there is a bike lane and it's illegal, many cyclists just take the shortest path, because they can). b) it's a problem than can mostly be solved by technology. I would like to see automatic pedestrian braking being required for new cars. I doubt we'll see bicycles with any kind of emergency braking system in the next decades.

Re: Diesel cars can be banned from German cities, court rules

#130

Post by inetknght »

harperlee wrote: post #126
TheLostOne wrote: post #45

As a German who never owned a car (have driver license 30+ years) and never will, hurray! Next: Petrol cars please. Costs for cities would decrease a lot [1], room for bicycles would increase, noise would drop to a level which can't believed, ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on and air would be wonderful. [1] https://www.amazon.de/High-Cost-Free-Parking/dp/193236…

> ambulances would be adjusted to walking persons instead of loud cars with their stereos on German ambulances and firetrucks have an unbelievable siren volume! It is piercing - I have to literally cover my ears if I'm a bystander. I have never heard anything like that in other European countries or the US. So I suspect that you can already lower their volume if you German people were willing to, seeing that it works…

I hear it all the time in Houston. I'm pretty sure it's because of high noise plus most modern vehicles trying to reduce or eliminate outside noise. Emergency vehicles need to punch through all that noise reduction.
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