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Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

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Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#401

Post by jpttsn »

grasshopperpurp wrote: post #397
jpttsn wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you personally pay this, or is it only a good idea if it’s someone else’s money?

As maym86 said, I'd be happy to contribute to the pool of resources that would allow something like this to be sustainable. Would you not? >The city pays for it. The shelter runs it. "It is a win-win," said Presbyterian Night Shelter CEO Toby Owen. "We want a clean neighborhood that speaks hope, that speaks dignity to our homeless guests. And it also provides income for these individuals so they can move out and be s…

There's a difference between paying a $10 hourly wage and contributing to a pool of resources.

I'm guessing my own contribution would be far less than $10 per hour if this were tax financed.

If you and I can agree to each pay $5/h, maybe let's start there and find other people who also want to pay? Wouldn't that be better?

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#402

Post by to3m »

walshemj wrote: post #396
TylerE wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait until you figure out how much even a low flow shower uses.

Yes I could I have a Btech in thermo fluids :-) but this is doing the dishes by hand after a large meal no way do you use that much.

It must surely include rinsing under a fast-flowing tap (something I rarely bother with personally), and/or maybe doing the washing under a running tap too. I don't see how you could get to 120L otherwise.

120L = 7 very full sinkfuls of my fairly standard size kitchen sink. 7! For 12 people's-worth of stuff!

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#403

Post by heartles »

driverdan wrote: post #199
dahart wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know, but I think C02 isn't the primary concern. Petroleum usage and plastic waste are greater concerns. And if you're worried about the air, note that plastic manufacturing produces considerably more toxic gases than steel production. Considering how many vehicles and buildings are built with steel on this planet, I'd bet that the volume of steel needed to provide every person on earth with a steel straw onc…

> but I think C02 isn't the primary concern. Petroleum usage and plastic waste are greater concerns. CO2 is the primary concern. Storing waste is not a problem in most parts of the world. The amount of steel it would require isn't important. What's important is how much energy it takes to make that straw and the other environmental impacts of doing so. It takes magnitudes more energy to melt steel than it does to mel…

> The best option is to stop using straws. They're completely unnecessary unless you have a physical disability.

I will note that straws are useful while driving, as you can drink without obscuring your view of the road. There's an argument that you shouldn't be distracting yourself from the road like that, but that's sort of a different discussion.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#404

Post by omegaworks »

gnicholas wrote: post #375
omegaworks wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So we need studies now to tell you to occasionally clean the bags you put raw meat into?

That’s one way to interpret the results. Alternatively, the study shows that in the normal course of human behavior, plastic bag bans may have nontrivial negative health impacts. Also, it shows that in considering the carbon footprint of reusable bags, we should factor in regular (not occasional) cleaning. Considering that a reusable bag needs to be reused many (hundreds, if memory serves) of times before reaching ca…

Carbon neutrality is not the only metric by which we create these regulations. Nor should it be. Single-use bags introduce many externalities that are captured and controlled by imposing a minimal cost.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#405

Post by emodendroket »

to3m wrote: post #402
walshemj wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I could I have a Btech in thermo fluids :-) but this is doing the dishes by hand after a large meal no way do you use that much.

It must surely include rinsing under a fast-flowing tap (something I rarely bother with personally), and/or maybe doing the washing under a running tap too. I don't see how you could get to 120L otherwise. 120L = 7 very full sinkfuls of my fairly standard size kitchen sink. 7! For 12 people's-worth of stuff!

It sounds like he was describing just measuring how much a typical person washing dishes uses. I'm sure if you were specifically concerned with conserving water you could do better.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#406

Post by emodendroket »

walshemj wrote: post #398
emodendroket wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plug the sink next time you're washing dishes.

Why do you think I don't? And use a washing up bowl

I never do except by accident and it illustrates to me that I'm using a ton of water when I hand-wash dishes.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#407

Post by grasshopperpurp »

jpttsn wrote: post #401
grasshopperpurp wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As maym86 said, I'd be happy to contribute to the pool of resources that would allow something like this to be sustainable. Would you not? >The city pays for it. The shelter runs it. "It is a win-win," said Presbyterian Night Shelter CEO Toby Owen. "We want a clean neighborhood that speaks hope, that speaks dignity to our homeless guests. And it also provides income for these individuals so they can move out and be s…

There's a difference between paying a $10 hourly wage and contributing to a pool of resources. I'm guessing my own contribution would be far less than $10 per hour if this were tax financed. If you and I can agree to each pay $5/h, maybe let's start there and find other people who also want to pay? Wouldn't that be better?

Kind of an a-la-carte approach to civic responsibilities? I can envision ways in which it'd work, and people would feel better about it (in general) than they do taxes. It seems like something like this would work best at a local level, which would obviously apply to the particular example we're discussing. In theory, I'd be on board with it, as long as federal programs/taxes remained. If you found a way to implement it on a larger scale, I'd be surprised/impressed.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#408

Post by jpttsn »

grasshopperpurp wrote: post #407
jpttsn wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a difference between paying a $10 hourly wage and contributing to a pool of resources. I'm guessing my own contribution would be far less than $10 per hour if this were tax financed. If you and I can agree to each pay $5/h, maybe let's start there and find other people who also want to pay? Wouldn't that be better?

Kind of an a-la-carte approach to civic responsibilities? I can envision ways in which it'd work, and people would feel better about it (in general) than they do taxes. It seems like something like this would work best at a local level, which would obviously apply to the particular example we're discussing. In theory, I'd be on board with it, as long as federal programs/taxes remained. If you found a way to implement…

But why should it be surprising? So many people advocate for change just like you do; what mechanism could keep the idealism from being realizable?

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#409

Post by gnicholas »

omegaworks wrote: post #404
gnicholas wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s one way to interpret the results. Alternatively, the study shows that in the normal course of human behavior, plastic bag bans may have nontrivial negative health impacts. Also, it shows that in considering the carbon footprint of reusable bags, we should factor in regular (not occasional) cleaning. Considering that a reusable bag needs to be reused many (hundreds, if memory serves) of times before reaching ca…

Carbon neutrality is not the only metric by which we create these regulations. Nor should it be. Single-use bags introduce many externalities that are captured and controlled by imposing a minimal cost.

No one said it is the only metric. But it is a relevant one.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#410

Post by HumanDrivenDev »

philliphaydon wrote: post #400
HumanDrivenDev wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

have you ever asked for a receipt where one hasn't been offered?

Yes. And never heard of any additional cost.

Well you must go to classier places than I do (:
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