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Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

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Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#71

Post by pc2g4d »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #60
ryanobjc wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, what you're saying is that, apart from buying goods and services from rural areas, that the rest of the countryside should somehow assist, with tax money, the rural citizens? Strange that you'd say that, from a population historical of voting for anti-tax candidates. Perhaps not you personally. In other words, you'd like to socialize the downsides of living in remote areas of the country?

Not so. The state takes our taxes and runs the schools. The rural areas get little funding for their schools, even for the same size school (the same tax base approximately). No, its city folks voting all the money to their schools. Its democracy, but its not pretty.

I thought taxes for education stayed within the school district locally.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#72

Post by IntronExon »

axaxs wrote: post #66
IntronExon wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even an 30min from one of the 10 biggest cities on the USA, broadband is still unavailable to a majority, ambulance times are in hours, and school funding is increasingly disappearing. The first claim seems unlikely, unless that’s 30 minutes at the speed of sound. I’d need solid citations to bite. The second seems unlikely as well, and given how bad response times can be in disadvantaged parts of cities, I’d wonder i…

I don't have a solid citation, apologies. But remember 4 of the top 10 cities are in the, landwise, mostly uninhabited Texas and Arizona. It's not a stretch to drive out of the city and lose access to broadband. I'm in a top 30 city and absolutely driving 30 minutes away takes broadband off the plate...depending on direction(south and west do, north and east dont).

That’s fair enough on the citation. I would point out that as you say, Texas and Arizona are heavily urbanized, and outside of that, very sparsely inhabited. TX having ~84% urban population, and AZ nearly 90%, that’s going to be hard to cover the other small percentage with broadband. Texas, despite being one of the “Big 8” ranks 32nd for average population density.

In other words rural TX and AZ are atypical.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#73

Post by pc2g4d »

Slansitartop wrote: post #42
lev99 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People in rural areas have less options to live with their parents while attending a college. People that live with their parents while going to college save a significant amount of money compared to people that live on their own. College costs are actually not the same for everyone. It's hard to find two people that have the same degree and paid exactly the same for it. It's easy to find two people eating the same b…

That's true, and actually amplifies the point I was trying to get across. A low rural cost of living doesn't help low-income rural kids afford college, since the college is likely in a higher income city area and priced accordingly.

So maybe colleges need a cost-of-living adjustment?

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#74

Post by QuarterReptile »

spamizbad wrote: post #61
nugi wrote: post #6

The world continues to focus on cities, while the rest of the people are left behind. I notice a clear metropolitan bias on HN, often incredulous that 1st world citizens are still living in a unimproved state. Even an 30min from one of the 10 biggest cities on the USA, broadband is still unavailable to a majority, ambulance times are in hours, and school funding is increasingly disappearing. Please keep in your minds…

For those not in poverty what you describe is -- indirectly -- a feature not a bug Schools are disappearing because there is no tax base to support them, and the remaining residents tend to favor an austere government. There's also a degree of distrust of governmental organizations. There are a lot of small towns where, if the state government came in and said "We're going to build you a school for free and you won't…

I'm just going to point out regarding schools: if you let the state come build it for you, you're probably going to get a big, deadly dumpster fire of a school. It'll be a regional consolidated school so they can put a huge educational campus all in one place. It'll be far from any town because that's where the land is cheap. Everyone will have to choose between driving their kids to school or putting them on hour-long bus rides. And it'll abut a road where the 85th percentile speed is in excess of 50mph, which is not the smartest place for a hive of people who are immature and inadequately familiar with their own mortality. And some of them will probably be driving to it, too.

Then 25 years from now, those kids will find the asterisk from the state where they find themselves liable for all the maintenance on the huge complex they couldn't afford in the first place when the ceiling is leaking and there are cracks growing in the gymnasium's walls.

Hard to imagine why they don't have much affection for the programs provided by taxation. Admittedly, it's petty to take those grievances out on the local government, which probably provides the only public services they like. But when all you hear about is federal and state foolishness, and all you can affect is your own town, the misplaced anger isn't that surprising.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#75

Post by leggomylibro »

thomastjeffery wrote: post #57

If you live in a city, you can likely attend a college from your parents' house. For those of us in rural areas, that is not even remotely true. If you intend to attend college, but live in a rural area, you have to prepare for all the expenses of living on your own, on top of quickly rising college expenses. You need a place to live, a budget for food, possibly even transportation. There is also a general wealth dis…

Colleges tend to make it very easy to live in a new area, though. It's a problem that they've had to deal with for centuries, and one that they tend to be very sensitive towards.

There are dormitories and meal plans, but those can be expensive. For the frugal, most universities have their own small housing departments which help students find safe and affordable housing in the area.

But maybe there's a bit of a personality thing in how people view the experience. My grandmother, for example, cannot understand why I don't feel a strong connection and pull towards the land that I was born on. Whereas I cannot understand why anyone would.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#76

Post by Retra »

thomastjeffery wrote: post #51
VectorLock wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why shouldn't the world focus on cities? If you're choosing to live in an area where you're geographically separated from other people can you really complain that you're not receiving benefits from systems that are more optimal when people are clustered together?

Why should the world focus on cities? Those who are born and raised in rural areas can't just uproot their lives the moment they turn 18 and start to afford, or even enjoy city life. Because the commute is closer? It's still at least as slow in many places, because of traffic problems generated by tighter clusters of people. The idea that cities are the most optimal is an idea, not a proven fact. Your experience may…

I grew up in a rural town. I left right when I turned 18, and so did most everyone I know. Maybe they shouldn't have let WalMart come in and destroy all the local businesses. Maybe they shouldn't have sold the paper mill to 4 different conglomerates with significant lay-offs each time. And maybe now they shouldn't vote republican in every election like they truly don't give a shit about anybody.

Nobody is going back. Nobody is going to help that community recover. The people in charge of that community did everything in their power to make it unappealing for their children, and it will stay that way.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#77

Post by dzdt »

vanilla_nut wrote: post #43

As a graduate of a very rural American school (to give you an idea, my entire pre-k through 12th grade school was housed in a single building, with below 500 kids total; my graduating class was just over 30 students, and I was one of 3 who went on to a 4-year school -- fewer than 10 of us went to any college at all)... this article isn't very good. Like some other commenters have pointed out, the author failed to int…

I had a similar experiencee to you, but more positive. My school was about half the size of yours. I did senior year classes at the community college. My parents pushed the school board on this, and the district covered most or all of the tuition. Community college class credits transferred straight across to university, which not all AP classes do, so I came out ahead there.

Some things the article misses: in rural areas at least where I grew up there is a culture of avoiding loans and debt as much as possible. The current college culture expects students to rack up massive student loan debt. There is a clash there.

Also there is a lack of examples to follow. No one from my school has ever gone to an Ivy league college, for example. There is no one to ask about how it works or if it is even possible.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#78

Post by rdiddly »

ryanobjc wrote: post #55
nugi wrote: post #6

The world continues to focus on cities, while the rest of the people are left behind. I notice a clear metropolitan bias on HN, often incredulous that 1st world citizens are still living in a unimproved state. Even an 30min from one of the 10 biggest cities on the USA, broadband is still unavailable to a majority, ambulance times are in hours, and school funding is increasingly disappearing. Please keep in your minds…

So, what you're saying is that, apart from buying goods and services from rural areas, that the rest of the countryside should somehow assist, with tax money, the rural citizens? Strange that you'd say that, from a population historical of voting for anti-tax candidates. Perhaps not you personally. In other words, you'd like to socialize the downsides of living in remote areas of the country?

Comment banned in my imagination for violation of imaginary ban on the phrase "So you're saying..." and its variants, which are almost always the opening tag of a sentence that misrepresents something.

"Strange that you'd say that..."

They didn't.

EDIT: Deleted sarcasm. Also adding: I say all this even though I actually lean the same way in my suspicion that rural dwellers probably absorb proportionally more public spending in some categories, while voting against "big government" etc.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#79

Post by sgtmas2006 »

bequanna wrote: post #13
nugi wrote: post #6

The world continues to focus on cities, while the rest of the people are left behind. I notice a clear metropolitan bias on HN, often incredulous that 1st world citizens are still living in a unimproved state. Even an 30min from one of the 10 biggest cities on the USA, broadband is still unavailable to a majority, ambulance times are in hours, and school funding is increasingly disappearing. Please keep in your minds…

> ... ambulance times are in hours Where? I live in an very remote part of Northern Minnesota. Even so, worst case ambulance time to most people in my area would be 15-20 mins. I would argue that an incredibly small portion of the US population lives >1hr from an ambulance or first responder.

The closest hospital from me is an hour away. 45 if you drive semi-fast. That time + whatever response time is. We had to call an ambulance for my father once and it was 20-30 minutes for them to arrive. It's not really that uncommon.

Re: Who's Missing from America's Colleges? Rural High School Graduates

#80

Post by freehunter »

bequanna wrote: post #13
nugi wrote: post #6

The world continues to focus on cities, while the rest of the people are left behind. I notice a clear metropolitan bias on HN, often incredulous that 1st world citizens are still living in a unimproved state. Even an 30min from one of the 10 biggest cities on the USA, broadband is still unavailable to a majority, ambulance times are in hours, and school funding is increasingly disappearing. Please keep in your minds…

> ... ambulance times are in hours Where? I live in an very remote part of Northern Minnesota. Even so, worst case ambulance time to most people in my area would be 15-20 mins. I would argue that an incredibly small portion of the US population lives >1hr from an ambulance or first responder.

When I was growing up in the rural Midwest, about 30 minutes from the nearest small-town hospital, we waited nearly an hour and a half for an ambulance to arrive to help my sister with an asthma attack because my mom couldn't drive and keep her breathing at the same time.
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