261–270 of 666 posts
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That and the target audience.
Yeh, if it had been framed as "we dealt with Meme makers and low and behold, the 13-30 year old men that used it made lewd, crude and frankly misogynist comments!" would anyone have been surprised?
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I think it answers the question quite well. Since men are harrassed more online, they tend to be unsympathetical when women complain of online harrasment, knowing women already experience somewhat less harrasment than men.
Sorry, what question did I ask that you think this report is answering?
Kids who grew up in an environment where anonymous interaction is the norm (such as kids who have anonymous social chats at school, or do in-game chats etc) have grown so accustomed to it that I don't think they even see it as sexist, racist, bullying etc. Most would probably never say any of this to someones' face, not out of fear of consequences but simply because they know better. Yet in anonymous contact they don…
>and that true anonymity doesn't exist either Yes it does, you are mistaken. An IP does not identify you if it's a proxy server or a VPN or a Tor node. All existing tracking methods can be fooled.
OPSEC is hard. Even people for whom it's a matter of life and death fail at it routinely. Angry trolls even more so. Your first message may be anonymous, but by your third message there's a good chance someone dedicated could find you if they cared enough.
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"Rude people are sexist" or "Sexist people are rude" is about the only conclusion you can draw here (maybe not even that, correlation != causation etc etc) It doesn't even come close to showing how "sexism is everywhere". For all we know the sample could be entirely edgy 12 year olds. Tell me again how this self-admittedly "non-rigorous scientific study" proves "sexism is everywhere"? It could easily be that more att…
"Rude people are sexist" still means we have a 'systemic' problem of sexism. In fact, one might argue that rude people being sexist are worse than polite people being sexist. Because the rude people are more disruptive over all. The statement 'sexism is everywhere' does not mean 'almost all people are sexist'. Instead, it means 'almost all women suffer from sexist attitudes in most areas of their lives. If 10% of peo…
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"Rude people are sexist" or "Sexist people are rude" is about the only conclusion you can draw here (maybe not even that, correlation != causation etc etc) It doesn't even come close to showing how "sexism is everywhere". For all we know the sample could be entirely edgy 12 year olds. Tell me again how this self-admittedly "non-rigorous scientific study" proves "sexism is everywhere"? It could easily be that more att…
I am so glad someone on HN is here to enforce rigorous standards when it comes to this topic, in particular. Because there have been multiple accounts of bad behavior, both subtle and not-subtle, at tech conferences ( https://shift.newco.co/what-its-like-to-be-a-woman-at-a-tech... , https://blog.juliaferraioli.com/2014/08/do-you-even.html ), but those aren't studies, they're just isolated experiences, so we can ignor…
I am so glad someone on HN is here to tell us exactly why we aren't allowed to have a rigorous discussion when it comes to this topic, in particular.
It is interesting how you immediately reframe women getting harassed as misogyny. Nevermind women likely get more attention online as well.
Let's have a look at the study [0] you mention. Which measures private messages received from an IRC channel by a bot. Do you honestly not think a female username will receive more attention given the typical gender composition of an online IRC channel? (Who still uses IRC apart from unwashed CS nerds?) 25 times messages likely means there were 25 times more males than females in that particular room.
[0] Meyer, R., & Cukier, M. 2006 http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.89....
This point is, without properly establishing a base rate of attention VS harassment, all you can do appeal to emotion. Yes women are being harassed in tech, are they being harassed in at a higher rate than other industries? Is it a specifically a tech problem? Is your solution to the problem to accuse men in the tech industry as misogynists/sexists further alienate both sides from each other when you don't even have proper evidence?
Amazing. The author spends a lot of time to tell us a very convincing story how sexism affects people in our industry, and the Hacker News thread is full of people rationalizing it. - it's only because people think you're a bot - it's because of your target audience - it's because chat widgets are annoying - you don't really have enough data to make any conclusions How much will it take to convince the average HN rea…
"How much will it take to convince the average HN reader that sexism actually is everywhere?" I presume those that think this way either have no female friends or have not asked them about it. Men generally don't get catcalls or get their body fondled by strangers.
All jokes aside, I can't say I'm surprised by the results. The internet allows to remove 2 important things humans use for communication: Physical presence (5 senses) and body language (non verbal communication). I doubt any of the 'offenders' in the tests would do anything even remotely close to the blatant sexism displayed if they were in the presence of the young woman.
Maybe such experiments actually 'force' communication to it's lowest common denominator, and any other conclusions on the character of the 'offenders' might be quite tainted. That being said, I completely agree with the conclusion that changing the avatar picture is a good idea, and avoids all the bad signal/noise ratio.
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"Rude people are sexist" or "Sexist people are rude" is about the only conclusion you can draw here (maybe not even that, correlation != causation etc etc) It doesn't even come close to showing how "sexism is everywhere". For all we know the sample could be entirely edgy 12 year olds. Tell me again how this self-admittedly "non-rigorous scientific study" proves "sexism is everywhere"? It could easily be that more att…
Also, rude comments aside, which avatar received the most useful comments?
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"Rude people are sexist" or "Sexist people are rude" is about the only conclusion you can draw here (maybe not even that, correlation != causation etc etc) It doesn't even come close to showing how "sexism is everywhere". For all we know the sample could be entirely edgy 12 year olds. Tell me again how this self-admittedly "non-rigorous scientific study" proves "sexism is everywhere"? It could easily be that more att…
The conclusion we can draw is pretty much what the author says: it's better to present yourself as an anonymous avatar than a real person. Despite what marketing people tell you about "creating a connection" or "showing that your company is made of real people", often a bit of distance and professionalism is best for your relationship with customers.
Only if you want to avoid rude/sexist messages. You can get more normal messages with good looking girl, and that's what matters for business.
Amazing. The author spends a lot of time to tell us a very convincing story how sexism affects people in our industry, and the Hacker News thread is full of people rationalizing it. - it's only because people think you're a bot - it's because of your target audience - it's because chat widgets are annoying - you don't really have enough data to make any conclusions How much will it take to convince the average HN rea…
And this shit is up top
Sigh