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America's misguided culture of overwork

salon.com

41–50 of 192 posts

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#41
post #30

standard offers i've come across in contracts is 2 free days per working month here, however 20 days is minimum by law not counting holidays. i've lived both in the US and EU, and while i feel there is more freedom in the US, the problem is as soon as you start working you can't enjoy them cause you're working 40+ hours per week and barely have any vacation.

Only working 10/11 days per month - 8 in February? Where is this?

20 (work-) days per year, not month.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#42
post #40
post #23

[deleted]

This day and age, "social mobility" is mostly a function of the dysfunction and inequality of the society in question. The -American angle is horribly overplayed. With some highly insulated exceptions, very few people actually have anything more than a thin veneer of rituals - if that - linking them to the "old country". There are some genetic personality traits but even those are more often shared with other America…

[deleted]

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#43
post #21

This guy has lots of facts wrong - makes you wonder about his accuracy in research: - no federally mandated six weeks of vacation time (though 4-5 weeks are the norm, even in private sector) - University tuition has been introduced recently (though still low, but will rise as obvious source of gov revenue) - Free nursing care / child care for a small percentage of toddlers only - No labor minister of that name (he is…

Correct, but he's at least a bit wrong in both directions. I was surprised to read people in Tupelo are three times wealthier than people in Hamburg; Tupelo might have a higher GDP, but certainly not three times. Maybe he was trying to be polemic? I still agree with the sentiment of the article. European societies sacrifice a bit of growth potential and individual freedom to get better living conditions for all. I th…

>>European societies sacrifice a bit of growth potential and individual freedom to get better living conditions for all. I think that's a wise move

The problem with sacrificing growth rates ought to be that interest accumulate -- that is, Europe becomes further and further behind.

But that seems to be countered by a variant of "second mover advantage" -- it is easier to grow fast when you are far behind (see e.g. China).

The Americans might be beating down the path for us. Who knows how slow we would otherwise move...?

Would be interesting to read a serious analysis of this.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#44
post #37
post #5

"free university tuition" -> Not true anymore, it's more like 300-600 Euros per semester. Still not much compared to the US but enough for german students to protest and public banks to create state-sponsored student loans. This type of loan for students was unknown before in Germany.

Are there state-provided student loans in Germany? Here in the Netherlands there have been for years (decades maybe? - I'm an immigrant here, my knowledge only goes back 15 years or so ;) )

Yes, although the rules change frequently. For me it was an interest free loan of which I had to pay back only 50%.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#45
post #33

I believe the author is wrong about GDP contribution of free tuition: "You know, it’s 50,000 dollars for tuition at NYU and it’s zero at Humboldt University in Berlin. So NYU adds catastrophic amounts of GDP per capita and Humboldt adds nothing." Granted, there are several approaches to calculating GDP but none of them ignores the government spending.

Ah, but does it cost the government of Germany 50,000 dollars for a years tuition?

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#46

This guy has lots of facts wrong - makes you wonder about his accuracy in research: - no federally mandated six weeks of vacation time (though 4-5 weeks are the norm, even in private sector) - University tuition has been introduced recently (though still low, but will rise as obvious source of gov revenue) - Free nursing care / child care for a small percentage of toddlers only - No labor minister of that name (he is…

Not to mention: ...it’s 50,000 dollars for tuition at NYU and it’s zero at Humboldt University in Berlin. So NYU adds catastrophic amounts of GDP per capita and Humboldt adds nothing.

Which is utterly false. The author is confusing business sector output and GDP.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#47
post #5

"free university tuition" -> Not true anymore, it's more like 300-600 Euros per semester. Still not much compared to the US but enough for german students to protest and public banks to create state-sponsored student loans. This type of loan for students was unknown before in Germany.

The school I want to attend here in the states costs $250 per credit hour. A bachelor's degree (4-year) is 120 credit hours. It's $30,000 USD. I know salaries in some parts of the EU are behind the US in terms of buying power within their respective countries, but even at 500 Euros, you're not paying anywhere near like what we're paying for school, even adjusted for your local wages.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#48
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe not so much in this specific instance, but Germany's economic and political structure (decentralisation of power and money) was a direct result of the occupation by the Allies, who wanted to avoid a strong central government. America was hugely influential in 1945-70.

But the Dutch, French, Scandinavian, and others aren't, and the those systems is very comparable to that of Germany. Many of the ideas originate from far before WWII, and had a strong presence (and development) in Europe since events such as the French revolution. It's America-centrism to think that all welfare and modernism is brought to the world by the USA. One typical anecdote a former exchange student told me, t…

Go educate yourself, the average Western-European citizen has more luxury, more free time, and better health-care than the average citizen of the United States (I know, I have visited the US often).

Help me educate myself. Provide some evidence.

Re: America's misguided culture of overwork

#49
post #18

I'm surprised wealth distribution wasn't mentioned in the stuff about GDP comparison. I'm no Economist but I was under the impression that wealth is distributed more evenly in European countries than in the US. We have rich people here in Europe but the US seems to have lots of insanely rich people and lots of poor people to go with it...

Well, it is more subtle than that, the distinction between wealth and money. For example, the Rothschilds cash fortune isn't comparable to the paper worth of someone like Gates. But arguably in any practical sense, the lifestyle they live, they're wealthier. European ideas about wealth are less about cash and more about (inherited/inheritable) tangible assets and connections to people at a similar level.

It's quite striking to read up on the differences in definitions of social classes between Europe and the US. In the US, class is almost entirely about income bracket, in Europe, class is mostly about your social network.
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