Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

nextrends.swissnexsanfrancisco.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 197 posts

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#111

Post by phil21 »

soperj wrote: post #42
timewarrior wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine you build an AirBnb like solution limited to Switzerland market. AirBnb will eventually come and eat your lunch. In today's globalized world - if you are not one of the bigger players and do not have moat (govt contract, some other kind of exclusivity) - other bigger players will come after you.

You say that, but there are cases even in small countries where this didn't happen. Like trademe in New Zealand which was just like ebay. Ebay still hasn't become the major place to do auctions in new zealand.

I think you just defined a moat. A tiny low population country that is one of the most hard to reach major countries in the world kind of proves that point, does it not?

Basically no one is competing in NZ because no one cares about the NZ market. It's simply not large enough. Until it is.

I do think there is a lot to be said about not trying to build these giant world-eating companies that require you selling your soul to the devil. Companies like Craigslist I have a ton of respect for. A lifestyle company should be the dream of most, not the crazy disconnected-from-reality VC world we're seeing today.

I simply think anyone betting on their market being small enough to fly under the radar is making a very tenuous bargain.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#112

Post by dekhn »

biztos wrote: post #83
dekhn wrote: post #47

I worked for a major biotech company in Silicon Valley that was part-owned, then later fully-owned, by a large Swiss pharmaceutical company. Well, it wasn't really a pharma company so many as a collection of wealthy Swiss families that maintained cross-investments in each other's pharma companies because it was a profitable sector. But I digress. Anyway, every year, the Swiss would send their top IT people to come lo…

> "At Roche, we only hire Swiss citizens to administer the SAP servers." Ex-Genentecher here too, and that quote really surprises me. Maybe it got that way later, but when I went to Basel in '95 to do some work I found a very international team. Granted, there were probably more Swiss among the IT guys than the Pharma people but it was by no means all-Swiss. The office language was English but the techies spoke a lot…

The SAP servers were considered a bit more core to the company's security, I think.

It's fair to say if there was an exception to that exec's claimed rule, it would be Germans.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#113

Post by refurb »

nextstep wrote: post #45
fuzzieozzie wrote: post #6

That lifestyle is possible in SV too .. it's a matter of how you choose priorities. At www.compilerworks.com we are purposefully bootstrapped to enable a high quality lifestyle (there are 3 of us in the Bay Area and 5 internationally).

I can work in SV and use great, reliable public transportation to get everywhere I want in my life, often in under an hour? And I can have 5 weeks paid vacation per year? I wasn't able to find these things when I lived there...

I agree with the public transport, but I live in SV and get 23 days of paid vacation plus 13 stat holidays.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#114

Post by [deleted] »

phil21 wrote: post #111
soperj wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say that, but there are cases even in small countries where this didn't happen. Like trademe in New Zealand which was just like ebay. Ebay still hasn't become the major place to do auctions in new zealand.

I think you just defined a moat. A tiny low population country that is one of the most hard to reach major countries in the world kind of proves that point, does it not? Basically no one is competing in NZ because no one cares about the NZ market. It's simply not large enough. Until it is. I do think there is a lot to be said about not trying to build these giant world-eating companies that require you selling your s…

[deleted]

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#115

Post by nextstep »

timewarrior wrote: post #3

I have been involved with Swissnex and been advising Swiss startups for some time. I also go to Switzerland every other year if not every year and meet with startups there. Things I noticed: 1. Incredibly smart people. 2. Behind Silicon Valley on best technology and product building practices by at least 2 years. 3. Great work ethic and social responsibility. 4. Do not have world conquering ambitions - which kinda wo…

Oh HN, how is this the top comment on this fantastic blog post about the huge lifestyle drawbacks from living in SV?

>> 2. Behind Silicon Valley on best technology and product building practices by at least 2 years.

This was clearly written in earnest, but works better as a satirical joke about the inward-facing nature of bay area tech. Please explain what "best technology and product building practices" means here, and how you can quantify that over time. What were the best practices of early 2016 which are just now being implemented in Zurich-base startups?

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#116

Post by ImSkeptical »

pm90 wrote: post #100
toomanybeersies wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, Trademe has never managed to penetrate markets outside New Zealand with any of its products, which limits its value. Xero, however, has massive potential for growth, because it's international.

> On the other hand, Trademe has never managed to penetrate markets outside New Zealand with any of its products, which limits its value. I don't understand why that is necessarily a bad thing. If someone is looking to make a shit ton of money, have a chance to monopolize or dominate the international market, then yes, that makes sense. But if you're happy and content serving nationally, and so are your customers, I…

If a product earns money, then hopefully it is providing value to users. If the number of users increase, more value is provided. If the number of users is arbitrarily limited, then people miss value they should get.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#117

Post by seanmcdirmid »

joe3774 wrote: post #85
workthrowaway27 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How easily can a US citizen find work there?

You can get a work visa if a Swiss company wants to hire you for a special skill or expertise you have. The easier way is probably to start working for a Swiss company in the US and then let you relocate to Switzerland still working for that company.

Is is still hard for US citizens to get bank accounts?

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#118

Post by seanmcdirmid »

fludlight wrote: post #23

> Assigned laundry days are commonplace...My laundry would be done on Friday night at 6. This seems efficient but also very off-putting.

Well, forget about doing laundry on Sunday, which was the weirdest thing about! Sunday's were like rest days, outside of train stations almost everything was closed, and to cap it off you couldn't do your laundry either.

My apartment was nice because we could sign up for chosen slots for any unspoken for time we wanted to do laundry rather than have one inflexible time assigned to us.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#119

Post by jiggunjer »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #107
mediaman wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very, very few banks lend in that scenario, which are typically zero or near-zero collateral. Yes, if you have plenty of receivables, and they're diversified, you can find banks to fund some working capital. But not operating expenses.

> "But not operating expenses." I'm not referring to operating expenses. I'm referring to investment in growth. The idea is to prove you have a business that can turn a profit by bootstrapping it yourself, then get a small business loan from a bank to take it to the next level. There are also other sources of business loans. Here's one example: https://www.fundingcircle.com/uk/businesses/ Here's another: https://www.…

I think this is how many franchises grow. But most highly educated people aren't interested in starting a restaurant or mini-mart.

Re: Forging a Swiss Lens: How Zurich's tech scene changed my view of SV

#120

Post by seanmcdirmid »

matttproud wrote: post #27
romanovcode wrote: post #5

Hey, but at least you get paid more in U.S., right?

Hardly. The tax system in the United States and California is markedly inefficient in terms of price and what you get out of it. CH taxes are minimal, and the body politic and municipalities just work. Source: I lived and worked in S.V. and live in Zürich for several years.

It really depends on what you are doing, though pay for grad students and post docs was definitely higher in Switzerland than in the states. Living expenses were high also, and if you think finding an apartment in San Francisco is hard, it is MUCH harder in Switzerland as a foreigner, and probably more expensive to boot.
Post reply on HN