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Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

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41–50 of 52 posts

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#41
I am a massive fan of the band Phish. There is no band better than the worst Phish performance. I believe this.

Phish isn't what it used to be. This is objective; there are more wrong notes and the songs are performed more slowly, some of the really technical stuff barely gets performed anymore. I am harshly critical of this because I know what the band is capable of.

You wouldn't (maybe you would) believe how other fans react to my criticism. Outright denial plus I'm obviously there to ruin it for them. It's a childish reaction. Don't like criticism of your favorite things? Wear earplugs.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#42
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In German, is it also used in a darker sense, as the counterpoint to envy? For example, an acquaintance goes on what would be your dream vacation, but is plagued by illness. I hope this article is not a sign that we are losing the word in English to people who want to affect erudition, as we don't have a good native substitute (and that is not because English speakers do not have such emotions!)

Without having more details, I generally wouldn't say one would feel Schadenfreude in your example. Now, if your acquaintance is obnoxious or is putting everyone down for not being able to afford their dream vacations, then yes, Schadenfreude would apply. In more general terms, you don't feel Schadenfreude whenever something bad happens to someone. There has to be a sense of "Well, that guy had it coming".

Maybe, but none of the ~dozen definitions that I have found have this 'they had it coming' qualification. This, may, however, be the way the meaning is going in English.

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-most-American-dictionaries-prov...

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#43
post #40

I can't draw a sharp line between cultural and personal criticism. As an example, I find certain genres of modern music distasteful for their lack of harmony and musical value. I can't really tell if this is cultural or personal criticism. Is this essentially the point that the author is making?

I deal with this personally by arguing that artistic merit is effectively objective - that whether a work of art is "good" or "bad" is independent of personal tastes. There are lots of good works of art that I simply don't like (and frankly, lots of bad art that I love).

This is mostly as a counter to the common-as-dirt conceit of "I don't like this, therefore it sucks" that is many people's loud response to stuff that happens outside their own culture.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#44
post #41

I am a massive fan of the band Phish. There is no band better than the worst Phish performance. I believe this. Phish isn't what it used to be. This is objective; there are more wrong notes and the songs are performed more slowly, some of the really technical stuff barely gets performed anymore. I am harshly critical of this because I know what the band is capable of. You wouldn't (maybe you would) believe how other…

I feel your pain. I was a Deadhead back in the day, and a lot of, well, shallow Deadheads couldn't wrap their heads around the idea that some shows were better than others, and some eras were better than others. Mid-late 1980s Grateful Dead performances could be mighty disappointing. (Although lately, I'm coming to appreciate the good ones.)

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#46
post #26

"But all critics think they’re doing the world a favor. If they didn’t believe this delusion, criticism wouldn’t get written." I disagree, some people just like to burst bubbles. I think it makes them feel better.

The world needs pessimists as much as it needs optimists.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#47
post #28

There's no discussion possible without the confrontation of ideas, which means that criticism is vital for any progress. And also getting seriously hurt by criticism might be a warning sign that one's having some deeper ego issues. No one likes it, but grownups are supposed to be able to cope with the fact that others don't share your ideas... either by re-evaluating your own views, or by ignoring others'.

> There's no discussion possible without the confrontation of ideas

I agree. Ha! ;)

This borders on suggesting that all criticism is good and altruistic and beneficial to society. I think the vast majority of all criticism is ego driven, motivated by wanting to feel superior. Most of it doesn't produce progress or discussion. When it's hurtful, it's usually because it was intended to be hurtful which means it's more than critique.

> grownups are supposed to be able to cope with the fact that others don't share your ideas

There's a difference between evaluating ideas and looking only for faults. There's a difference between critique and criticism. It sounds like you are talking mostly about critique, except for this part about being grownups. While your statement is true, it's only half. Grownups also critique without criticizing, they can evaluate something without putting others down, without insulting or being mean.

http://abacus.bates.edu/~rrichar2/learn/ui/critique.html

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#48
Doesn't this ignore criticism that provides specific examples for the claim being made?

For example, I remember there was an essay by Achebe on "Heart of Darkness" where one of his arguments was the racism of the author affected the quality of the prose: "'A black figure stood up, strode on long black legs, waving long black arms...' as though we might expect a black figure striding along on black legs to wave white arms!"

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#49
There is a sermon I love, that talks about dealing with ambiguity, and in it is defined 3 levels of dealing with ambiguity, the second mirrors the claims made in the article. I'm just going to leave a big quote because it explains it so well:

The English writer G. K. Chesterton once addressed questions similar to those I have raised today. He distinguished among “optimists,” “pessimists,” and “improvers,” as he called them, which roughly correspond to my three levels of dealing with ambiguity. He concluded that both the optimists and the pessimists looked too much at only one side of things, and observed that neither of them can be of much help in improving the human condition, because people cannot solve problems unless they are willing both to acknowledge that a problem exists and yet retain enough genuine loyalty to do something about it.

More specifically, Chesterton wrote that the evil of the excessive optimist (level one) is that he will:

"defend the indefensible. He is the jingo of the universe; he will say, “My cosmos, right or wrong.” He will be less inclined to the reform of things; more inclined to a sort of front-bench official answer to all attacks, soothing everyone with assurances. He will not wash the world, but whitewash the world."

On the other hand, the evil of the pessimist (level two), wrote Chesterton, is:

"not that he chastises gods and men, but that he does not love what he chastises ... [In being the so-called ‘candid friend,’ the pessimist is not really candid.] He is keeping something back—in his own gloomy pleasure in saying unpleasant things. He has a secret desire to hurt, not merely to help. . . . He is using the ugly knowledge which was allowed him [in order] to strengthen the army, to discourage people from joining it."

(The reference to the army, I think, is talking about "God's army" (informally, e.g. the "believers"), as this is in a religious context)

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#50
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In German, you can combine a bunch of words to create a new one. Feel free to read the full explanation on a pretty awesome example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donaudampfschiffahrtselektrizi...

I have used this to test a business directory to check how it handles long company names.

I also used the famous long welsh place name to test addresses with :-) "Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch"
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