Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say • Hacker News Board

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#151

Post by nickodell » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:13 PM UTC

djsumdog wrote: post #28

So either this was a security breach, a human mistake or a psyops/test on a small isolated American population. In the first case, we'll probably only be told about it if they actually make an arrest and the system is patched. The second is an interesting case, we'll come back to. The final one: it was intentional and used to track what happened on the islands, and to also watch that information propagate back to the…

>With their immense data collection architectures and ties to large tech companies, they could easily filter the keywords and images they want, and get measurements of how quickly this information propagates and how people react.

Ok, but what would be the point of that?

You would either discover that people are terrified of nuclear war, in which case... you can't do anything useful with that information. Or, you'd discover that people don't respond to the message, in which case... you can't do anything with that information.

Why would anyone who wasn't a particularly stupid villain intentionally do this?

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#152

Post by conspiracyies » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:15 PM UTC

intopieces wrote: post #80

If I were going to erode public trust in emergency broadcast systems in order to increase the amount of damage I would do by launching an actual missile, this is how I would do it. A series of false alarms. A similar, if obviously much smaller and less disastrous example, happens at my apartment about 4 times a week: the fire alarms for entire floors of my apartment building are easily triggered by people smoking in…

Fuck you and fuck this bullshit conspiracy nonsense.

Evolve a bit, idiot.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#153

Post by sorenbs » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:16 PM UTC

dmix wrote: post #119

intopieces wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at the screenshot of the alert [0], it appears to be using the alert system adopted in 2006 in response to the Warning, Alert, and Response Network (WARN) Act[1]. How is this system for a missile attack different, and in what way is it being revisited for the first time in a generation? Text messages are just now 1 generation old (SMS first implemented 1992[2]; generation is about 25.5 years[3].)And of course…

Well they tested the nuclear/missle attack warning sirens in Hawain cities for the first time in a very long time last month. Just because the sirens were installed during the cold war doesnt make the new attention and urgency being given to them is any less new. Same with the underlying infrastructure behind cell phone alerts being old while the systems on top are being newly revised and tested. Clearly there is a w…

I'm surprised the sirens aren't tested more frequently.

In Denmark we have a national system of sirens. They are tested once a year at a specific date and time. In the cold war era they used to test them every Wednesday at noon, but it has been scaled down since then :-)

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#154

Post by BjoernKW » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:16 PM UTC

jacksmith21006 wrote: post #127

Not to sound crude but if a nuclear bomb what can people on an island really do?

It doesn't matter if you're on an island or not.

An ICBM (which is what you're usually talking about with nuclear bombs) takes about 30 minutes to reach its destination, which will be a large population centre.

So, you have less than 30 minutes to get out of a large city. Because you won't be the only one to try this there will be major congestion on top of the usual city traffic. Public transport could be an option but I wouldn't be so sure that trains keep running either once such an alert has been issued.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#155

Post by dictum » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:16 PM UTC

alexnewman wrote: post #147

djsumdog wrote: post #28

So either this was a security breach, a human mistake or a psyops/test on a small isolated American population. In the first case, we'll probably only be told about it if they actually make an arrest and the system is patched. The second is an interesting case, we'll come back to. The final one: it was intentional and used to track what happened on the islands, and to also watch that information propagate back to the…

I’ll take that bet that you are wrong. I assume you believe this but not enough to bet money that you R right

It's a bet that cannot be settled: intelligence documents are only declassified long after the fact, and even then may be full of misdirections and information that requires internal knowledge to interpret.

(It's also in the interest of three-letter agencies and external state actors to raise the suspicion that they have the capability to do something even when they don't.)

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#156

Post by conspiracyies » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:17 PM UTC

joering2 wrote: post #135

makecheck wrote: post #85

An interesting Reddit comment described a chaotic traffic situation for 20 minutes (people running lights, wrong-side-of-the-road driving, extreme speed, etc.). Human nature in these moments is very “Tragedy of the Commons” apparently.

Just recently I spoke to my friends that literally are living in LaLa land. They are making fun of me prepping and saving dry food, water, stacking up on legal guns and munition. I took upon challenge last xmas to meetup with them and they brought my prepardness as one of laughing subjects. It really saddens me when they believe that when gloves of society are off, we all gonna be happy singing kumbaya and respecting…

Being prepared for an emergency isn’t a bad thing. Being a “prepper” is fucking conspiracy level bullshit. They shouldnt even be your friend. Nobody should be your friend, you’re a fucking moron.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#157

Post by conspiracyies » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:19 PM UTC

This thread is so fucking full of consipracy nut jobs, it’s goddamn insane.

What a sad day for humanity.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#158

Post by tetha » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:19 PM UTC

packetslave wrote: post #117

Just watched an interview on CNN with the Governor of Hawaii and their director of emergency management. Pretty impressed that the director didn't throw anybody under the bus. He basically said "An employee pushed the wrong button. It's my responsibility, so this is my fault. We're going to make procedure and technical changes to make sure this doesn't happen again."

That's how it should be. As I maintain - mistakes are places where the systems and automation are too weak for our fat fingers, and mistakes of my team are my mistakes.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#159

Post by throwacide » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:19 PM UTC

blantonl wrote: post #139

packetslave wrote: post #117

Just watched an interview on CNN with the Governor of Hawaii and their director of emergency management. Pretty impressed that the director didn't throw anybody under the bus. He basically said "An employee pushed the wrong button. It's my responsibility, so this is my fault. We're going to make procedure and technical changes to make sure this doesn't happen again."

A lot of people are calling for the person who did this to be instantly fired, but I've always been of the opinion that the guy that pushed that button would be an outstanding hire - because he'll never, ever do something like that again and he's learned an important lesson.

Misguided. Circumstances are that he either is or is not qualified for a single point of failure job like that. If not it’s management failure. If the human is “qualified” for a single point of failure responsibility like that, he’s now fired.

Re: Alert About Missile Bound for Hawaii Was Sent in Error, Officials Say

#160

Post by cryptoz » Sat, Jan 13, 2018, 9:20 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #77

charlesdm wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd assume a potential strike by an incoming missile is important enough to interrupt said meeting?

If NORAD said “incoming missile strike,” sure. That isn’t what happened. The civilian notification system sent out a false positive. Saying “false alarm” would require, at that point, asking the military for affirmative confirmation nothing is wrong. That is a lower priority than responding to an active threat.

> That is a lower priority than responding to an active threat.

No, that is the active threat and anyone in power would know it. A panicked civilian population can do about as much damage as a real bomb and the military knows it. Such a long delay in the all-clear message is incompetent and dangerous.