Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

scientificamerican.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 104 posts

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#81

Post by darpa_escapee »

35bge57dtjku wrote: post #72
the8472 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider a world where every human traveled by plane like you do and where also every human used recycling as you do. Would you prefer living in that world?

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_juice/2014/07/dri...

> Consider a world where every human traveled by plane like you do and where also every human used recycling as you do. Would you prefer living in that world?

According to the above article, one would prefer that.

> The trend has continued so that in 2010, flying burned just 2,691 BTU per passenger mile—an improvement of 74 percent since 1970. That was 43 percent better than driving the average car, which gets about 21.5 miles per gallon (4,218 BTU per passenger mile)

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#82

Post by methehack »

swampthinker wrote: post #2

I hate this feeling of hopelessness regarding global warming. It feels like even if you were a billionaire/massive corp, at some point you would say "wow we should stop, or else there won't even be a world to spend this money in".

w/r/t the tragedy of the commons... The thing that I'm a little afraid to say out loud is that I don't see how any of this is solved with our current political structures. Sovereign nations? Democracies? At some point -- when the sh#$ really hits the fan -- these structures are going to seem like idealistic but ineffective luxuries. I suppose catastrophe (my sense is there will be no need to engineer it) could spur inspired alignment; or some kind of global consciousness awakening event (we're waiting, Jesus 2.0/Whatever).

The long arch of hope seems pretty hopeless from an individual's perspective at this moment in time, so much so that I actively try (and fail) _not_ to think about this. I can't imagine what folks at, say, the pentagon, are planning out who spend all day obsessing on it. They must have some pretty dark scenarios mapped out.

Simply put, we have grown to the size of our resource container and that container is about to shrink. We're far from ready. The species will likely eek it's way through. Civilization? Not so much.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#83

Post by mikeash »

throwaway9990 wrote: post #13
jacquesm wrote: post #5

The oceans are by far the most important eco system on the planet, they have tremendous capacity for healing and regeneration but once that gets pushed too far there may be no way back. And without the oceans alive the world will be hungry. There are many bad things the Trump administration might be remembered for domestically but internationally the most visible decision was the withdrawal from the climate change ac…

Posting from a throwaway because politics. Wouldn't there also be more different fish now especially in places that used to be covered by ice? Sure, some species might die off but you might get more new species as well. Some new fish perhaps that is good at living in lower oxygen concentration. Also, the fish that lived in the tropics can move to subtropics and so on. I see it as more of a change that's not really ba…

Of course the Earth will be fine. The issue is about human civilization.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#85

Post by gajjanag »

bamboozled wrote: post #17
yodsanklai wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share your feeling, but I also note this contradiction: > I spent quite some time in South-East Asia > I come home, diligently recycling my trash Not saying you shouldn't recycle your trash, but your flights are much more impactful for the environment than your trash.

Is flying really that bad compared to ocean pollution? I feel like flying is overall a pretty efficient means of transport, everything is geared towards efficiency. Plastic in the oceans, now that’s a mess.

The impact of flying has been very nicely estimated in the freely available book "Sustainable Energy - without the hot air" by the late Prof. David MacKay FRS: http://withouthotair.com/c5/page_35.shtml and http://withouthotair.com/cC/page_269.shtml if you are interested in how he arrives at the estimate.

The book also remarks upon how a (theoretical) revival of ocean liners would actually be worse.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#86

Post by aneil »

spodek wrote: post #45

Nobody mentioned reducing pollution and greenhouse emission is the best way to help the situation so I will -- non-polluting alternatives to flying, eating meat, heating and cooling (I'm surprised how many people heat their homes in the winter so they can walk around in shorts), packaged food. Having fewer children. As a community, HN seems to think nuclear energy is easy while carpooling or flying less are misguided…

Conscious consumption doesn't work. It ignores financial incentives, and we know how that story plays out. In particular, companies have a fiduciary responsibility to exploit resources for shareholder gain. Until that problem is addressed, we're headed for disaster.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#88

Post by korzun »

yodsanklai wrote: post #10
stingraycharles wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's partially related to something akin to the prisoner's dilemma: it's a world-wide problem, and "we" might not want to take the financial hit for being the first in leading the cause. I spent quite some time in South-East Asia the past few years, and when you see the sheer amount of boats that just dump all their trash in the ocean, and the sheer lack of awareness of the issue, it makes you hopeless. I com…

I share your feeling, but I also note this contradiction: > I spent quite some time in South-East Asia > I come home, diligently recycling my trash Not saying you shouldn't recycle your trash, but your flights are much more impactful for the environment than your trash.

I'm not following the logic. Planes would fly either way.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#89

Post by sandworm101 »

stingraycharles wrote: post #3
swampthinker wrote: post #2

I hate this feeling of hopelessness regarding global warming. It feels like even if you were a billionaire/massive corp, at some point you would say "wow we should stop, or else there won't even be a world to spend this money in".

I think it's partially related to something akin to the prisoner's dilemma: it's a world-wide problem, and "we" might not want to take the financial hit for being the first in leading the cause. I spent quite some time in South-East Asia the past few years, and when you see the sheer amount of boats that just dump all their trash in the ocean, and the sheer lack of awareness of the issue, it makes you hopeless. I com…

It is too late to worry about going first. A great many countries have already stepped up.

Recycling isnt much help. Putting a few meters of solar on your roof is far more important. Not taking a first-class flight to vacation on the other side of the planet is also good. Installing an entire roof of solar, and making sure your grandparents vote against the coal lobby, that's the best anyone can do atm.

Re: Ocean's Oxygen Starts Running Low (2016)

#90

Post by mdekkers »

stingraycharles wrote: post #3
swampthinker wrote: post #2

I hate this feeling of hopelessness regarding global warming. It feels like even if you were a billionaire/massive corp, at some point you would say "wow we should stop, or else there won't even be a world to spend this money in".

I think it's partially related to something akin to the prisoner's dilemma: it's a world-wide problem, and "we" might not want to take the financial hit for being the first in leading the cause. I spent quite some time in South-East Asia the past few years, and when you see the sheer amount of boats that just dump all their trash in the ocean, and the sheer lack of awareness of the issue, it makes you hopeless. I com…

I can't help but wonder whether this is all just a show, and not addressing any of the core issues that are needed to fix this

That´s exactly what is going on.

Post reply on HN