AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion • Hacker News Board

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#101

Post by CamperBob2 » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:19 PM UTC

mabbo wrote: post #21

This is what's being accomplished by one amateur with a little bit of hardware. Imagine what will happen when you have professional services (legal or otherwise) making altered videos of whoever or whatever you want. Want court evidence of your wife cheating? Fake grainy hidden camera video. Want to discredit a politician? Here he is picking up a male escort and using racial slurs. These sorts of things could be used…

The propaganda potential will be interesting as well. My favorite recent example so far: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYEY4x0_RDY

With a few obvious exceptions -- like one particular shot of Ivanka's face that crosses the line from realism all the way past comedy into horror -- some of these replacements are almost good enough to start fooling people. Voice synthesis is approaching the 'solved problem' point as well (e.g., https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfU_sWHT8mo ). Not there yet, but getting there.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#102

Post by Izkata » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:24 PM UTC

phinnaeus wrote: post #34

everdev wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the technique does make fraudulent videos easier to make, I don't see this in and of itself as that fatal to public trust. Faking content to hurt someone has been around forever. We then learned not to trust gossip, not to trust uncorroborated sources, etc. I hope it might actually help people be more skeptical of what they're reading and seeing. And hopefully it will help news media be more skeptical of their…

> We then learned not to trust gossip, not to trust uncorroborated sources, etc. Somewhat ironically, I feel a citation is needed here.

Makes me think of the phrase "pics or it didn't happen".

Granted it was a lot more common before photoshop-style software was everywhere.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#103

Post by Izkata » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:28 PM UTC

onion2k wrote: post #9

blunte wrote: post #2

On the flipside, this gives anyone basic plausible deniability. No baby, that homemade porn video on my phone wasn't me! I just used a program to stick my face on something I found on the internet.

Plausible deniability doesn't really work in real life though. Very few people are going to give you, or anyone accused of an indiscretion, the benefit of the doubt on the basis that a video might have been faked with AI. That is much less plausible than someone cheating and getting caught. If you think anyone is going to accept that a video is fake, even if it is , then you're woefully naive.

Doubt could be made if you kept a video of yourself with Arnold Schwarzenegger's body in the same place as that video.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#104

Post by superkuh » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:33 PM UTC

nailer wrote: post #3

celebfakes is the next Reddit hand grenade: the site has 'involuntary porn' as a category for reporting posts, yet simultaneously has a popular subreddit dedicated to involuntary porn.

Citation needed? What subreddits? If you mean the tiny deepfakes subreddit I don't think anything there is involuntary.

In case it isn't clear, this isn't leaked videos or celebrities doing actual porn. It's synthetic renders similar to their faces based on publically available material. The celebrities aren't actually involved in any way. It isn't even really photos of them. It's an abstract model.

But surely you understood that? And in that case I don't get what you're saying.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#105

Post by CM30 » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:34 PM UTC

riffraff wrote: post #88

CM30 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't say it's much of a shift as much as an arms race between hoaxers and investigators. In the olden days you certainly had less ways to fake footage (no image editing or digital forms of manipulation), but at the same time it was also much easier to trick people into believing falsehoods. I mean, look at the older stuff on the Museum of Hoaxes. It'd be shot down in minutes in 2017, since it's obvious the peop…

Just as food for thought, being able to lie or con people is also not necessarily a bad thing: Giorgio Perlasca was able to save more than 5000 Jews from deportation by posing as the Spanish consul in Nazi-occupied Budapest. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giorgio_Perlasca

That too. Lying isn't necessarily evil, and the fact it's possible has averted a lot of tragedies as well as caused others.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#106

Post by DoreenMichele » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:36 PM UTC

blunte wrote: post #2

On the flipside, this gives anyone basic plausible deniability. No baby, that homemade porn video on my phone wasn't me! I just used a program to stick my face on something I found on the internet.

In the scenario posited, it would depend a lot on a) the character and reputation of the denier and b) the gullibility of the person being lied to.

Of course, people who would both make such a video and also lie to their SO about it tend to seek out gullible easy marks who buy their BS. But sometimes such people get wise to it at some point.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#107

Post by tedivm » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 9:37 PM UTC

I just read the post and there are points where it flat out lies about what a source said.

From the article-

> There are studies that demonstrate that porn viewing desensitizes ones genitals and reduces white matter in the brain. https://www.wired.com/2014/06/is-it-really-true-that-watchin...

Then from the article they linked to in order to justify that claim it says the opposite-

> It's just as likely that men with less grey matter in their striatum are more attracted to porn, as opposed to porn causing that brain profile. The researchers know this. "It's not clear ... whether watching porn leads to brain changes or whether people born with certain brain types watch more porn,” Kühn told The Daily Telegraph

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#108

Post by knieveltech » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 10:08 PM UTC

nostrademons wrote: post #86

knieveltech wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just set your credibility on fire with the phrase "the extreme bias between newspapers and TV channels picking and choosing facts". What you are describing is literally the opposite of how objective journalism is performed. That you believe this is how professional newsrooms function indicates you haven't worked in the industry.

That you and vertex-four disagree not only on the facts, but on the nature of facts indicates that perhaps his point has some merit. ;-) FWIW, I've been that primary source for some major news stories, and the final story usually bears just a passing resemblance to reality as I experienced it. Assuming good faith on the part of the reporter, I have to assume that reality as I experienced it bears only a passing resem…

"That you and vertex-four disagree not only on the facts, but on the nature of facts indicates that perhaps his point has some merit."

Unlikely. One of us has spent a large chunk of their professional career working in and around newsrooms.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#109

Post by yakitori » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 10:21 PM UTC

mabbo wrote: post #21

This is what's being accomplished by one amateur with a little bit of hardware. Imagine what will happen when you have professional services (legal or otherwise) making altered videos of whoever or whatever you want. Want court evidence of your wife cheating? Fake grainy hidden camera video. Want to discredit a politician? Here he is picking up a male escort and using racial slurs. These sorts of things could be used…

This is why we all should be skeptical of the media ( traditional and social ) as public skepticism is the only thing preventing mass hysteria. If the public were a tad bit more skeptical and didn't believe everything they read in news or social media, we would have avoided the wars of the past 15 years.

But every criticism of traditional media here gets flagged. Which is ridiculous for a "hacker" news site when you think about and the hacker ethos.

Re: AI-assisted fake porn are being used by people on Reddit for self-completion

#110

Post by stanfordkid » Sun, Dec 31, 2017, 10:41 PM UTC

knieveltech wrote: post #108

nostrademons wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That you and vertex-four disagree not only on the facts, but on the nature of facts indicates that perhaps his point has some merit. ;-) FWIW, I've been that primary source for some major news stories, and the final story usually bears just a passing resemblance to reality as I experienced it. Assuming good faith on the part of the reporter, I have to assume that reality as I experienced it bears only a passing resem…

"That you and vertex-four disagree not only on the facts, but on the nature of facts indicates that perhaps his point has some merit." Unlikely. One of us has spent a large chunk of their professional career working in and around newsrooms.

The fact is that facts lie and don't always capture the big picture and they certainly don't capture the importance of an event in and of itself.

With millions of events happening each and every day the simple act of choice is incredibly meaningful.

Your own belief in the objectivity of modern newsrooms proves my point.

Clearly both Al-Jazeera and Fox News do fact checking... yet one would be left with a very different view of the world depending on who did the reporting.