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A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

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Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#451

Post by unclebucknasty »

jmull wrote: post #427
braderhart wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks Apple PR.

Oh come on. At least you can express what you think is wrong about my take on it rather than just calling me a shill. I'm not a shill, BTW. I was affected by this and think Apple stinks for letting it get to this point. I found out my iPhone 6+ was running at 600Mhz most of the time when it would normally would run at 1400Mhz (going by CPU DasherX). Also, the real world user-experience seemed to be even worse than th…

>just don't generally expect tech companies to always get it right, especially not the first time.

I think you're being far too generous to Apple. I won't repeat my previous comment on this thread, but the gist is they knew what they were doing, they knew rumors were swirling for years about slowing down older devices, and they certainly knew that slowed devices encouraged increased participation in their incremental update-oriented product roadmap.

There is no reason they couldn't have been transparent about this much earlier and, AFAIK, no technical reason this battery management software couldn't have been released earlier.

Given this context, to say they're just figuring it all out and suggest we should ignore their "mistake" and give them credit because they are now doing the right thing does seem a bit naive.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#452

Post by MBCook »

emn13 wrote: post #191
MBCook wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is right that this is a fundamental battery issue. Other phones must have SOME way of dealing with it. Does anyone know how Samsung phones (for example) deal with low battery voltage issues? Do they simply adjust the battery meter so that it reports zero percent by the time you might start having these issues? Does it slow the phone down The way Apple did? Does it issue some sort of warning that your battery is…

If by "fundamental battery issue" you mean that all phones have this issue or some comparably severe tradeoff, then no, this is not a fundamental issue. Batteries don't all degrade at the same rate, and even given a specific battery tech, the way it's implemented in the device can have a dramatic impact on the longevity. Temperature, rate of charging, the degree (i.e. voltage) up to which it is charged, the degree (i…

There are ways to try and mitigate it, but when I was really getting at is that if you use ANY device with the lithium ion battery long enough something like this will end up happening.

Some other phone may be designed so it takes an extra year and a half or two, but it will still happen one day.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#453

Post by raquo »

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #295
djsumdog wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't the first time this has happened to Apple. They use to not sell replacement batteries for the original iPods, and when people called in to complain, they were often told to buy an entire new iPod. This was settled in a lawsuit: http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/articles/comments/apples-ip... Another important note is this battery replacement cost only cover the iPhone6 and up. That's only the 2015 release.…

Agreed. It’s also a waste of human labor to throw away devices when they could still be made useful with some simple repairs. To go further, it is wasteful to design hardware to be disposable rather than repairable and reusable. People with jobs I wouldn’t want to do work very hard to bring us these devices, and the earth gives up resources to mine, transport, and shape the materials. Throwing things away when they c…

It's because everything is so cheap nowadays, because all the externalities that we worry about (pollution, resources running out, etc.) are left for the public and future generations to bear, with those who actually cause those externalities not paying their dues.

Unfortunately, I don't see this changing within our culture of mindless consumerism and a governance system based on what is essentially legalized bribery ("lobbying").

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#454

Post by Someone »

IBM wrote: post #16

I still think Apple should sue some publications for defamation for the manifestly bad reporting about this story [1]. Here's John Siracusa about it [2]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15995018 [2] https://overcast.fm/+CdQP59ws/56:00

Why would they, if other people throw mud on their brand, respond by throwing more mud?

The proper response is to clean their brand. That’s what they do now. I think it is better late than never, but it also is somewhat (depending on how picky they will be on replacing those batteries, and on whether they will pay back people who replaced their battery recently because of this problem) classy.

I also think this is intended to, and will, stop the class action suits being filed before they have even started.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#455

Post by jasonkostempski »

jmull wrote: post #115

> Apple is reducing the price of an out-of-warranty iPhone battery replacement by $50 — from $79 to $29... > Early in 2018, we will issue an iOS software update with new features that give users more visibility into the health of their iPhone’s battery, so they can see for themselves if its condition is affecting performance. There we go. It took too much trouble and too long for it to happen, but Apple is stepping u…

I'd like to see them and everyone else reintroduce removable batteries. If you're "in the field" all day, it's very convenient to have a second battery to swap out and those external battery powered chargers can be just as inconvenient as being tethered to an outlet.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#456

Post by dclowd9901 »

reaperducer wrote: post #107
marklyon wrote: post #73

My wife’s 6+ was incredibly slow after the iOS upgrade. My 6+ drained the battery incredibly quickly. I was told that upgrading the iOS would fix that problem [0]; it didn’t. Instead it slowed my phone to the point of being unusable. If I’d have known replacing the battery would have fixed both of them, I’d have done that. Instead, I stupidly bought two new, very expensive phones. Since we were already locked into th…

> This does nothing to compensate or win back the trust of customers like me. What is it that you want Apple to do to make you personally feel better?

I think they could offer free battery replacement for affected models for the next year, and, more permanently, a 1 hour or less turnaround for battery replacement or a loaner program.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#457

Post by dandersh »

MBCook wrote: post #441
dandersh wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If Apple hadn’t made this change those phones would have randomly turned off instead" If Apple hadn't redlined the CPU to hit benchmarks the battery wouldn't have been in such a poor state to need to be shut down/throttled so early in its lifecycle. They are 100% to blame this situation and have taken the least consumer focused choice up until this point.

What percentage of maximum CPU should all phones be restricted to to prevent causing these kind of issues? That doesn’t seem like a reasonable solution.

It's more than reasonable to expect a manufacturer to not stress their (recently released) hardware to the point of it being damaged without significant throttling or flat out shutting it down.

But if it is that reasonable than surely there is a long list of electronic devices that do such a thing...

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#458

Post by madez »

carterehsmith wrote: post #443
madez wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You realize you are locked-in into a proprietary ecosystem. Clearly, that is bad for you and customer-unfriendly. But I wonder why you don't take action, and get alternatives that don't lock you in. Is this an example of the sunken cost fallacy?

>> you are locked-in into a proprietary ecosystem Ok, so what do we do? Sell iphone ((or android phone)) and then.. get what?

With Android you are not necessarily forced into a locked-in ecosystem. I use a Google-free Android phone. I can watch movies and listen to music, talk to people and chat. And I'm free to take my data and move to another device.

So, yes, extracting all of your data Apple is not withholding from you, getting another device, and then selling the Apple devices is what I would start with.

Also, I would keep an open eye for neither Android nor Apple devices. The Librem 5 might become an excellent alternative.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#459

Post by wwweston »

austenallred wrote: post #251
jhack wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe if they made their iPhones that fraction of a millimetre thicker, they'd have the courage to bring back a headphone jack into their $1000 phones.

I know it's not common for people to say this out loud, but I spent $1200 on an iPhone last month, and a. I don't care about a headphone jack, at all; I use Airpods and the experience is phenomenal b. Consider me crazy, but I actually like my phones getting smaller and lighter What if Apple is just making a phone for people like me, and is comfortable with those trade-offs?

> I don't care about a headphone jack, at all

Does "works for me" work for you as a reason for closing a software ticket?

Built-in speakers and bluetooth are probably the most common audio output cases for me, and I suspect it's that way for most people. It's totally fine and probably a good idea to recognize that and improve the experience on that front.

But complicating corner cases are a definite reality. If you're someone who was treating your iPhone as a digital musical instrument, for example, bluetooth's latency probably makes it a no go for you. But of course, that's too niche, not a market that Apple does or should have to care about, those people should be buying more complicated niche hardware, right? OK, let's use a "normal consumer" example: if you're someone who likes to connect your iPhone to a car stereo, then maaaybe bluetooth will work out for you, or maybe it's going to be an interesting challenge dealing with the auto/stereo manufacturer's implementation. A 1/8" aux input? Just works. And lets you charge your phone at the same time. Or at least it did.

And before someone says "well, get a dongle" -- a dongle isn't "just works." And that's the thing that bothers me so much about this. It's essentially a user-hostile decision for some portion of users, with no particularly compelling upside for the rest of users... but a thin margin of manufacturing savings and a nice accessories/integration play, I suppose. I fully expect that's just business for many enterprises and "just works" is an acceptable casualty, but I didn't expect it from Apple.

But I do now.

> I actually like my phones getting smaller and lighter

Surely there's a point of not only diminishing but actually vanishing returns. Maybe literally. I recognize that's not going to be the same for everyone, but for me "diminishing" started around the form factor of the original iPhone and I stopped seeing any particular utility in shrinking around the 4s.

Re: A Message to Our Customers about iPhone Batteries and Performance

#460

Post by lowtolerance »

krutzger wrote: post #139
MBCook wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Apple hadn’t made this change those phones would have randomly turned off instead. Those people probably would’ve gone and bought either a new were iPhone or switch to android like you did. On the whole I don’t think this would have caused anyone to spend money they wouldn’t have otherwise. Perhaps they would have stayed with their phone longer. It’s hard to tell, and this is certainly worse than if they had just…

>If Apple hadn’t made this change those phones would have randomly turned off instead. Why is apple the only company with this problem?

They aren’t. Lots of devices utilizing lithium ion batteries experience similar issues once they get some age.
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