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What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

nytimes.com

91–100 of 176 posts

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#91

Andy Byford just left as CEO of the TTC to take this challenge on. He’s a more ambitious man than I, to actively seek to try to fix the NYC MTA. I wish him luck and wish we did more to support him while he was here.

Totally agree! He was able to accomplish a lot at the TTC with pretty tight resources.

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#92

New York doesn't have enough money to get it done. The politicians are too busy paying for all the election promises they've made over the last 50 years. And they absolutely need to cut the bureaucracy (code word for 'unions' and 'government agencies') that are deeply entrenched in the government. I don't think New York can do it until the people get tired of watching the decay and the current political machine gets…

> I don't think New York can do it until the people get tired of watching the decay and the current political machine gets voted out. We're tired of it, but New York government is not a democracy. The two ruling parties have passed an complex network of laws which, in effect, mean that officials are accountable only to the political party, not to their constituents. Case in point: one of the largest advocates of elim…

A lot of the reason I remain living in New York is because of fusion voting. It makes me feel as though it would be much easier to switch to a third party without totally breaking with the established parties. Unfortunately, third parties in NYS have yet to grow a spine and endorse their own candidates, primarily because if they don't get enough votes in the elections they cease to exist (i.e., why Working Families endorsed Cuomo instead of Teachout last gubernatorial election).

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#93

New York doesn't have enough money to get it done. The politicians are too busy paying for all the election promises they've made over the last 50 years. And they absolutely need to cut the bureaucracy (code word for 'unions' and 'government agencies') that are deeply entrenched in the government. I don't think New York can do it until the people get tired of watching the decay and the current political machine gets…

I'm curious how much money is needed. Why is it that Japan, Hong Kong and most developed European cities have much better rail transportation ? I don't think money is the only issue. NYC is probably one of the richest cities in the world and yet you say they don't have the money to fix this ? I know construction in US is expensive but it can't be that bad.

>" Why is it that Japan, Hong Kong and most developed European cities have much better rail transportation?

Japan is an interesting comparison because the lines are private and independently owned and so there's competition[1]. Once upon a time the NYC train line were private and independently owned they were the BMT, IRT and the IND[2]. You still vestiges of this in some stations. At any rate it was thought that that having privately owned train lines might allow them to hold the city hostage and so they were bought by the city. Obviously there's a great irony in that now.

[1] https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2011/10/why-tokyos-pr...

[2] http://www.nytimes.com/1990/06/30/nyregion/about-new-york-al...

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#94

I find this situation incredibly interesting as an outsider. I live in the SF Bay Area where we have a Muni "subway", if you can even call it reminiscent of one and BART. They're both absolutely awful, between not having good/expansive coverage/timely service. A plethora of issues plague both. Both times I visited NYC this year I took the subway everywhere. Out of probably 40-50 subway rides, only a handful were dela…

The NYC subway system is orders of magnitude better than anything else in this country, absolutely. This also means that pretty much everyone relies on it to get around every day---so we have to hold it to a much higher standard. If the subway were as bad as it is in SF, the whole city would more or less stop functioning entirely.

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#95

I find this situation incredibly interesting as an outsider. I live in the SF Bay Area where we have a Muni "subway", if you can even call it reminiscent of one and BART. They're both absolutely awful, between not having good/expansive coverage/timely service. A plethora of issues plague both. Both times I visited NYC this year I took the subway everywhere. Out of probably 40-50 subway rides, only a handful were dela…

> I found NYC's subway a pleasant improvement. Yet I keep seeing articles about how it needs to be fixed. Decades of underinvestment means that it's not as good today as it was ten years ago, or as good ten years ago as it was a few decades before that. That said, even with all its problems, the NY metro area still has far better and more extensive public transportation than any other metro area in the country. Over…

Yet I have heard horror stories of how it was so run down in the 70's and 80's that people were afraid to even take it at all.

Isn't this a case of people glorifying the past? Are there objective metrics that demonstrate service quality has degraded (reduced train frequency, reduced amount of seats, etc...)?

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#96
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I found NYC's subway a pleasant improvement. Yet I keep seeing articles about how it needs to be fixed. Decades of underinvestment means that it's not as good today as it was ten years ago, or as good ten years ago as it was a few decades before that. That said, even with all its problems, the NY metro area still has far better and more extensive public transportation than any other metro area in the country. Over…

Yet I have heard horror stories of how it was so run down in the 70's and 80's that people were afraid to even take it at all. Isn't this a case of people glorifying the past? Are there objective metrics that demonstrate service quality has degraded (reduced train frequency, reduced amount of seats, etc...)?

> Are there objective metrics that demonstrate service quality has degraded (reduced train frequency, reduced amount of seats, etc...)

Yes, there are, and the NYTimes has reported that data in previous articles from this same series.

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#97
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I found NYC's subway a pleasant improvement. Yet I keep seeing articles about how it needs to be fixed. Decades of underinvestment means that it's not as good today as it was ten years ago, or as good ten years ago as it was a few decades before that. That said, even with all its problems, the NY metro area still has far better and more extensive public transportation than any other metro area in the country. Over…

Yet I have heard horror stories of how it was so run down in the 70's and 80's that people were afraid to even take it at all. Isn't this a case of people glorifying the past? Are there objective metrics that demonstrate service quality has degraded (reduced train frequency, reduced amount of seats, etc...)?

It was really terrible in the 70s when the city went bankrupt. Then it got better, and now it's getting worse again.

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#98
What would it take to fix the subway? Money of course. Where's it come from? Who cares, just spend it. Transit is necessary. Tax the businesses that benefit from good transit. Raise the gas taxes, because driving is a luxury if you could have taken mass transit. Boston's transit is a mess too. Some of the problems can be fixed just by throwing money at the problem. The Boston subway breaks down all the time because the cars are way past service life. You can just buy new cars, and service will improve a lot. But they waited so long that breakdowns are constant. The new cars won't be here for years, but we don't need any upgrades other than buy the cars and put them on the tracks. It's seriously frustrating that these things are in such a bad state when massive improvements can come by just spending money to fix old broken stuff. Call me naive, but I just want better public services, and I understand it costs money.

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#99
post #98

What would it take to fix the subway? Money of course. Where's it come from? Who cares, just spend it. Transit is necessary. Tax the businesses that benefit from good transit. Raise the gas taxes, because driving is a luxury if you could have taken mass transit. Boston's transit is a mess too. Some of the problems can be fixed just by throwing money at the problem. The Boston subway breaks down all the time because t…

After reading your comment twice, I still can't tell if it's sarcasm or not...

Re: What Would It Take to Fix New York’s Subway?

#100
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think you understood what parent meant by “single track”: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-line_working

> I don’t think you understood what parent meant by “single track”: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-line_working I understand what they meant; I'm explaining that even when running trains on dedicated tracks (e.g. the local line is shut down for maintenance, but the express line still runs), it causes delays that many find unbearable. Running trains in both directions on a single track would degrade service ev…

In fact, single-tracking in most of the subway degrades service even more than it technically needs to, due to the inability of the interlocking system to reverse track directions. To single track the MTA has to tie down the stop arms and coordinate by radio, and it is almost never worth it. The MTA does sometimes use single tracking in the East River tunnels, where the interlocking allows the track direction to be reversed.

For comparison, the entire PATH system supports changing the track direction, and single-tracking is relatively common during weekends. Of course, the PATH is much smaller and has a different history behind it, not to mention totally different legal requirements (it is a "railroad" rather than a heavy rail system).

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