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Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

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Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#91

Post by hacknat »

I think in our industry a cover letter might send a negative signal. In other fields a cover letter is a sign that you’re a “go-getter”. A good software engineer is two things: in high demand, and a professional problem solver. A cover letter sends the signal that you are the type of person who works harder not smarter. I’d be much more impressed if you LinkedIn stalked me and sent me a quick two sentence message about why you would be jazzed to work at my company (I.e problem space and why or culture fit and why).

On the whole it doesn’t really matter though.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#92

Post by brailsafe »

Maro wrote: post #90

I review about ~100-200 CVs per week in bulk, for Data Science. I actually treat a cover letter as a negative signal. Who has time to write one, and why you do think anybody cares? Show where you worked, what you did, link to some interesting stuff, all this in the regular CV structure, and that's it. I have about 10-20 seconds per CV, reading a cover letter is out of the question. The only thing the CV is for is to…

> Who has time to write one, and why you do think anybody cares?

How did you get your current job, and what is your opinion about the summary or cover letter space in almost every job application form? Assuming of course that you don't have an alternative means into the company.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#93

Post by brailsafe »

bllguo wrote: post #66
tyingq wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Almost any time that a client asks for a cover letter, my response is "Here it is, and I hope you never have to use it". That seems kind of absolute. If I were applying to, say, an auto manufacturer, the cover letter might be the obvious place to state why I'm interested in working there. And why I'm a good choice. Like, "I've always been a car nut. I even wrote an open source library to access CAN bus data here: ht…

Well that assumes someone reads it. Unfortunately that seems pretty unlikely. I used to personalize stuff like that but I got worse results than when I just used a cookie-cutter template and mass fired. Anecdotal of course

Were they proportionally worse? As in, did you have a higher success ratio or more successful responses in total because you were able to send out a higher amount of applications?

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#94

Post by brailsafe »

zhte415 wrote: post #89
starwind0 wrote: post #25

Personally I have never really seen the point in writing one. My resume has all my abilities and even a bit about me. The recruiter is going to scan the resume and let the computer decide if I get the interview. That said the smarter thing you can do is copy the job posting, attach it to the end of your resume. I usually do it in micro print and white, as it's just for the machines. Speaking as someone that has inter…

Can you not manage time sufficiently to spend 2 minutes reading a 6 page resume and hopefully spending a good 15+ minutes thinking about what u just read?

  minutes = 20; // 2 + 15+
  n = resumes.size(); // 6
  Time t = contemplateResume(minutes, n);

  // If you manage time sufficiently,
  // you'll not be spending that much time looking at only the first indication of a candidate's fit for a role

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#95

Post by curun1r »

As a hiring manager, the cover letter was the most important part of the packet that I was given. The resume was pretty meaningless since I've seen plenty of bad candidates with good-looking resumes and vice versa. But the cover letter was a much more reliable signal of a quality candidate.

For me, there were two important goals that a cover letter was supposed to accomplish. The first was that the cover letter should prove to me that the applicant read the job posting. I took time to write an engaging job posting that wasn't just a list of job functions and qualifications. The cover letter should explain why the applicant is the person I'm looking for by essentially regurgitating everything that I've asked for in the job posting and citing relevant experience, skills or traits of the applicant.

The second is to prove to me that you invested some amount of time into applying. If I choose to schedule a phone interview and possibly an in-person interview that may include airfare and hotel, I'm going to be investing a non-trivial amount of resources into you as a potential hire and I'd like to believe that you're willing to kick in the 10 minutes or so it takes to write the cover letter. I'd like to be one of a handful of places you're applying and not one of 50 or so. A customized cover letter is like a proof-of-work system that prevents resume spam. It may seem tedious, but that's the point. It should be hard to automate and if I believe that you're using the same cover letter for multiple companies, I'll pass.

As an applicant, the formula I follow when writing them is to start by talking about why the company's product or mission is compelling to me. If I have difficulty writing this, I rethink applying in the first place since it's really hard to enjoy working for a company with goals that don't excite me in some way. After I've talked about why the company is appealing, I pick the two or three most-emphasized things from the job posting that I feel describe me and write why I believe that. I save linking to Github for the top of my resume.

But that's me, and by some of the responses here, I gather others feel differently.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#96

Post by expertentipp »

ravenstine wrote: post #64

I almost never need to write my own cover letter. The closest I get to a cover letter is if I have an opportunity to send an email to a company I like, and I know the email will go to someone not in HR. If I have no choice but to interact with HR, either I'll see it as a red flag and won't bother applying or I'll apply with no cover letter. Yes, this does mean I won't get interviews at most companies. Writing cover l…

> When it comes to searching for a job, best to not waste cumulative hours of your life writing material that won't be appreciated.

Cover letters aside, this includes take home assignments in particular.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#97

Post by bob_roboto »

expertentipp wrote: post #96
ravenstine wrote: post #64

I almost never need to write my own cover letter. The closest I get to a cover letter is if I have an opportunity to send an email to a company I like, and I know the email will go to someone not in HR. If I have no choice but to interact with HR, either I'll see it as a red flag and won't bother applying or I'll apply with no cover letter. Yes, this does mean I won't get interviews at most companies. Writing cover l…

> When it comes to searching for a job, best to not waste cumulative hours of your life writing material that won't be appreciated. Cover letters aside, this includes take home assignments in particular.

Having had to go through public interview processes (i.e. not being approached by the company or referred) recently for the first time in a while I can't agree more. Take home assignments are fine _after_ an interview. Companies that send you a take home assignment before they want to talk to you are a waste of time and quite frankly, it's rude and shows a lack of respect. The ultimate insult being not getting back to you even though you scored the maximum on their silly CS undergrad tests.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#98

Post by dizzystar »

bob_roboto wrote: post #97
expertentipp wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When it comes to searching for a job, best to not waste cumulative hours of your life writing material that won't be appreciated. Cover letters aside, this includes take home assignments in particular.

Having had to go through public interview processes (i.e. not being approached by the company or referred) recently for the first time in a while I can't agree more. Take home assignments are fine _after_ an interview. Companies that send you a take home assignment before they want to talk to you are a waste of time and quite frankly, it's rude and shows a lack of respect. The ultimate insult being not getting back t…

I find it more insulting when the rejection letter is poorly written and fill of grammar and spelling errors.

Re: Ask HN: Writing cover letters for tech jobs

#99

Post by matt_the_bass »

expertentipp wrote: post #96
ravenstine wrote: post #64

I almost never need to write my own cover letter. The closest I get to a cover letter is if I have an opportunity to send an email to a company I like, and I know the email will go to someone not in HR. If I have no choice but to interact with HR, either I'll see it as a red flag and won't bother applying or I'll apply with no cover letter. Yes, this does mean I won't get interviews at most companies. Writing cover l…

> When it comes to searching for a job, best to not waste cumulative hours of your life writing material that won't be appreciated. Cover letters aside, this includes take home assignments in particular.

We recently tried a take home assignment between the phone interview and in person interview for our latest round of interns.

We judged the take home to be less than 1 hour and removed the “white boarding code” portion of the in person. The goal was to remove the nervous factor when whiteboarding code and allowing candidates to write code in a format, language, ide that they are comfortable in. We then discussed their code during the interview.

We think this lead to shorter in person interview durations and a less stressful experience for the candidates.

We’re going to try this for a few cycles of internships and see what happens.

I agree though about take home work before the first interviews.

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