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BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

blog.bitpay.com

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Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#81

Post by SnowProblem »

Frogolocalypse wrote: post #72
fragsworth wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. Bitcoin + lighting network solves everything As far as I can tell, the Lightning Network's design isn't robust enough to solve everything. It allows for an arbitrary number of back-and-forth transactions between any two parties. It will be good, but it's not clear to me that this extends to solving all of the scalability problems.

I would suggest actually learning how it works before commenting on it. Lightning allows users to take a single bitcoin transaction, and use it over a finite space of time, in order to shift bitcoin back and forth, with no or vanishingly small transaction fees, as iou's between what are called 'lightning channels'. The actual transaction size will be the same as a normal transaction, with a flag that says it can only…

This is too complicated. I would gladly pay small txn fees to avoid having to manage payment channels.

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#82

Post by Frogolocalypse »

SnowProblem wrote: post #81
Frogolocalypse wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would suggest actually learning how it works before commenting on it. Lightning allows users to take a single bitcoin transaction, and use it over a finite space of time, in order to shift bitcoin back and forth, with no or vanishingly small transaction fees, as iou's between what are called 'lightning channels'. The actual transaction size will be the same as a normal transaction, with a flag that says it can only…

This is too complicated. I would gladly pay small txn fees to avoid having to manage payment channels.

It's no more complex than running any other bitcoin wallet. It is, after all, bitcoin. The only difference really is that lightning is instantaneous and immutable, where blockchain transactions require you to wait until a transaction has been confirmed in the relevant blockchain in order to be secure.

And no-one will force you to use it. If you choose to continue using bitcoin transactions natively, no-one is going to stop you.

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#83

Post by ryebit »

wmf wrote: post #74
gtrubetskoy wrote: post #69

Fascinating how all the comments explaining that for fast and cheap transactions there is Litecoin (which has SegWit and Lightning) and pointing out BCash (still vulnerable to transaction malleability because it does not have SegWit) technical and governance problems immediately got downvoted into oblivion. Edit: including this comment.

Fascinating how all the "just use Litecoin" comments don't count the value of continuity of the UTXO set, etc.

What is the value of maintaining continuity of the UTXO set?

Pretty much any BTC spinoff can and has forked the chain, auto-airdropping their coin to all BTC holders. You don't even have to go that far though, a coin could easily have a smart-contract style method of signing a message with your BTC private key, and get granted an equivalent in free starter coins.

Coins are also becoming increasingly fungible ... there's more exchanges every day, shapeshift/changelly style portals, and lightning adding atomic swaps across chains.

More importantly though, whether this is the end of the early adopter phase, or just a "late end of early adoption" phase... most people coming in won't want a coin with a lot of baggage and most of the value hoarded into a few accounts (inheriting BTC's chain could be seen as a negative there; and BCH's speedmining run didn't help it out).

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#84

Post by betoharres »

hrrsn wrote: post #28
davej wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I agree that Segwit2x would have been good for BTC, it ultimately only kicks the can down the road a little bit. If BTC (or BCH) is going to be used at Visa/Mastercard scale then the transactions need to happen off-chain. The Lightning Network is the answer here, a lot of work still needs to be done though, particularly on the software side.

This is the major (technical - plenty of political issues) problem I have with Bcash. It’s cheap and fast because transaction volumes, and price, are 10% of BTC, yet blocks are 1.5x the size (roughly, looking at a block explorer). As soon as they fill up, they’ll have the exact same problems down the line. Increasing the block size doesn’t scale long term and is a bandaid solution at best. BTC was fast and cheap when…

since we are in a dev news, you can agree that fancy solutions tend to fail. Simplicity is the key

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#85

Post by AgentME »

tmp9876 wrote: post #52
davej wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I agree that Segwit2x would have been good for BTC, it ultimately only kicks the can down the road a little bit. If BTC (or BCH) is going to be used at Visa/Mastercard scale then the transactions need to happen off-chain. The Lightning Network is the answer here, a lot of work still needs to be done though, particularly on the software side.

We could start using 'Side chains' today you might as well just create a bitcoin bank where everyone has an account hmmm hmm i mean a channel and all transactions can happen on your bank network and not on the blockchain. See i solved the problem. But first i need to convince everyone to use my side network, sooo if the main blockchain is like a stream what i need is for this stream to be blocked so that i can channe…

Payment channels and the lightning network aren't centralized; the users remain in control of their coins without counterparty risk. It's not like a "bitcoin bank" where they have to trust someone else to hold their coins for them. This is shitty FUD.

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#86

Post by ryebit »

asciimo wrote: post #79
hrrsn wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the major (technical - plenty of political issues) problem I have with Bcash. It’s cheap and fast because transaction volumes, and price, are 10% of BTC, yet blocks are 1.5x the size (roughly, looking at a block explorer). As soon as they fill up, they’ll have the exact same problems down the line. Increasing the block size doesn’t scale long term and is a bandaid solution at best. BTC was fast and cheap when…

Why do some people call Bitcoin Cash "Bcash?" It seems to accompany critical statements. I'll assume you're not doing it to save 6 letters, because later you refer to Bitcoin as BTC. You could have saved more letters by referring to Bitcion Cash at BCH. Is this a campaign to rebrand Bitcoin Cash as something other than a Bitcoin fork?

It's more a reaction to Bitcoin Cash officially insisting that it's the "real" bitcoin, and trying to actively misleading users by referring to BTC as "Bitcoin Core", creating a false parity to make it seem like they're both equal "forks" that bitcoin split into.

I've tried to refer to them using the less loaded "BTC" and "BCH" symbols instead; but it's kindof getting tiring, hearing people insist "Bitcoin Cash is Satoshi's True Vision". It's like somebody starting a "Apple Phone LLC" and saying it's Steve Jobs' true vision, ignore that other "Apple" company.

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#87

Post by Frogolocalypse »

betoharres wrote: post #84
hrrsn wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the major (technical - plenty of political issues) problem I have with Bcash. It’s cheap and fast because transaction volumes, and price, are 10% of BTC, yet blocks are 1.5x the size (roughly, looking at a block explorer). As soon as they fill up, they’ll have the exact same problems down the line. Increasing the block size doesn’t scale long term and is a bandaid solution at best. BTC was fast and cheap when…

since we are in a dev news, you can agree that fancy solutions tend to fail. Simplicity is the key

https://t4.ftcdn.net/jpg/00/01/72/17/240_F_1721760_5oY3RSyLM...

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#88

Post by ryebit »

CryptoPunk wrote: post #66
dylz wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you keep using the large phrase "chinese government controlled crypto bcash" instead of just calling it bcash? Sincerely, someone that isn't involved in all of this.

It's not even called bcash. It's called Bitcoin Cash. The 1 MB maximalists call it bcash because they don't want it to carry Bitcoin's legacy in the public mind.

Labelling everyone who does that "1 MB maximalists" is a little extreme, and is probably why people are irritated with BCH's marketing tactics.

To view your statement in a different light.. maybe people don't care for it trying to succeed based on another coin's name, rather than trying to stand on it's own merits. Bitcoin Gold (for all it's problems) doesn't try to insist it's the real Bitcoin. And 90% of the coins out there were confident enough in their tech to not prefix "Bitcoin" to their name.

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#89

Post by sincerely »

sergiotapia wrote: post #64
arkona wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bcash It’s Bitcoin Cash. You’re just making the community look like a cult.

It's bcash. From /r/bitcoin: >Starting a new company called Apple Unlimited! Please don't confuse this with our competitor, Apple. We did "borrow" all of their code, but we claim to follow the wishes of the great Steve Jobs, because the new guys that took over are ruining everything and censoring everyone!

Fortunately for everyone involved, this isn't r/bitcoin

Re: BitPay Will Process Payments on Multiple Blockchains, Starting with Bitcoin Cash

#90

Post by dannyw »

Frogolocalypse wrote: post #56
modeless wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they’ll have the exact same problems down the line But it could be years later; years in which other scaling solutions can be researched. If you only accept scaling solutions that can scale to infinity today, you will never accept a single one.

I only accept solutions that don't affect decentralization.

2 MB blocks (Bitcoin Classic) don't affect decentralization, if you support SegWit. SegWit blocks can be 4 MB, and that is 4 MB of data that has to be transmitted over the wire and stored unless you weaken your security model.

In fact, SegWit negatively affects decentralization because it is much harder to build and maintain your wallet because of all of the complexity of SegWit, pushing people to crowd around existing solutions.

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