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Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

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111–120 of 128 posts

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#111
post #2

The article repeatedly quotes statements to the effect “this was supposed to show what a truly free market looks like. Instead, it’s a shitshow.” The word “instead” doesn’t belong there. Really.

Wasn’t that the exact point of the tweet that was mentioned in the article?

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#112
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like it's a parable about lofty libertarian ideals -- everything's peachy until there's large sums of money involved. Bitcoin is fixable but now there's a financial incentive for never fixing it.

I should google it but I'll just wonder out loud, how would libertarians use money anyway? Doesn't money need something to back it up, i.e. a central bank?

Libertarians still believe in government, I believe the normal solution to this they propose is to move the money back to the gold standard with the gold held by the government issuing the money.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#113
post #76

Is anyone else getting the same sense with Bitcoin as with Trump leading up to the election? Everywhere I go everyone has negative things to say, everyone is going on about how it's going to crash. They all seem like sensible arguments. But here we are, Bitcoin keeps following an exponential curve and Trump is president. The one thing I know for sure is there's an awfully noisy signal out there.

People also predicted that Iraq and Afghanistan would be quagmires. Those predictions came true.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#114
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't send $50M of gold halfway around the world for $3.

You can't send $50 million of bitcoin with only $3 in transaction fees either

Why not? The cost you pay is proportional with your transaction size in bytes, not the amount of bitcoins you're sending. So it depends on how many inputs and outputs you're using, not the quantity you're moving.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#115
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't send $50 million of bitcoin with only $3 in transaction fees either

Why not? The cost you pay is proportional with your transaction size in bytes, not the amount of bitcoins you're sending. So it depends on how many inputs and outputs you're using, not the quantity you're moving.

The cost you pay isn't just dependent on how many bytes you want to send. Each block maxes out at 1MB and there's only 144 blocks a day. If you want your transaction to be confirmed, you have to outbid everyone else who wants their transaction to happen (as long as there's more than 7 transactions / sec). I don't think it is doable to try to do a transaction with a $3 fee, you need something like $20 worth of BTC to get it done within the next block or two, and maybe $10 if you're willing to wait a while[1]

[1] assuming https://estimatefee.com/ is correct. Based on the transactions of some of my friends it seems pretty accureate though

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, Bitcoin-backed debit cards.

Who cares about what they're backed with? If it's not bitcoin, then you don't get the benefits of bitcoin. The only difference between a normal debit card and a bitcoin-backed debit card is that the bitcoin backing layer is more expensive than the usual one.

You get at least one benefit. You can keep your large-scale financial life as private as you like. Not as well as with the newer privacy-focused cryptocurrencies, of course.

And that was arguably a key goal for Bitcoin. It came up in the shadow of ecash and e-gold. Although it's not as decentralized as many expected, it's also far less vulnerable to government takedown than ecash and e-gold were. But sadly, it's no less vulnerable to speculation than any other small currency has been.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#117
post #76

Is anyone else getting the same sense with Bitcoin as with Trump leading up to the election? Everywhere I go everyone has negative things to say, everyone is going on about how it's going to crash. They all seem like sensible arguments. But here we are, Bitcoin keeps following an exponential curve and Trump is president. The one thing I know for sure is there's an awfully noisy signal out there.

I voted for Trump and I bought some Bitcoins... hopefully I am right again.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#118
post #74

Bitcoin seems like just another medium of exchange. Almost all the properties of bitcoin - decentralization, anonymity, worldwide acceptance - apply equally well to gold bullion. The one additional property bitcoin had was convenience. But as transaction costs increase this is becoming less true. Given the above, why would anyone expect bitcoin to behave differently than physical gold in the real world? The world of…

I don't get how there's much anonymity with gold. I mean, you need to ship it.

The person shipping it doesn't need to know who the sending or receiving parties are, just where the pickup and drop-off are.

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't really create debt with money that you don't have, as the banks do. You can't make 1000$ appear on my bank account and say " you now have a debt of 1000$ to me". You need to give me physical money. But bank can create this money they don't have.

The bank isn't creating that money. When you deposit $1000 in a bank account, you lose that $1000 and gain 1000 FunnyMonies instead. The bank can then turn around and give that $1000 to someone else. At the end of the day, there's only $1000 running around. What makes it look different is that we treat 1000 FunnyMonies as if it were $1000. So instead of saying "there's $1000 and 1000 FunnyMonies" we say "there's $200…

Absolutely not. The bank can lend those 1000$ to several people.

I think it can lend it up to 10 times the money it has in its vault (not sure about the exact amount)

Re: Bitcoin is none of the things it was supposed to be

#120
post #18
post #14

The high transaction fees are forcing Bitcoin in this direction. If buying a hamburger cost you $30 in fees on top of the $6 burger, you'd stop using dollars for everyday purchases, too. Seems we're stuck in this situation so long as the block size remains where it is. That artificially reduces the supply of transactions, forcing the price up. No matter how many miners there are competing for those transaction fees,…

No one who owns BTC wants it used for transactions. They want it to be an investment and go up forever, so they'll never go with a fork that allows it. It's like home owners in a neighborhood locking out new construction so their own homes raise in value.

>they'll never go with a fork that allows it

Actually, I think that people would race to buy BTC before any fork, in order to get free money. (that explains why BCH has that volume/market)

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