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The compelling case for working less

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Re: The compelling case for working less

#151

Post by Ended »

Chinjut wrote: post #50

There is a frequent pattern which concerns me of primarily justifying the desire for reduced work hours in terms of the alleged increase in productivity this will bring about (by allowing recharging, preventing burnout, etc.). I worry that this already concedes too much. This allows for just as much stressful dominance of work over the rest of life, and shame over any deviation from this script, as maximizes producti…

Totally agree. I was disappointed to see the article follow the trend of framing everything in life around the notion of productivity. But one can only be thankful that poor mental health is correlated with poor productivity - it means the evolutionary pressure for modern capitalist society is at least acting in the right direction...

Re: The compelling case for working less

#152

Post by dominotw »

spyckie2 wrote: post #7

I'm convinced that our decision for how much effort to exert on work is not governed by the rational part of our brain. It's part primal - fear of insecurity and belonging to a social structure - part ego - accomplishment as confirmation of existence and your salary as a concrete number to compare favorably to others - and part culture and habit. I also think overwork is a byproduct of a globally connected society. H…

I think it has more to do with insecurity about future. Sure I can work less and live a pretty cozy life a software developer. But I have no idea what will happen to my profession and to me in 10 yrs. Who knows if I'd be able to keep up with tech in 10yrs, maybe my brain will slow down. My job can be outsourced tomorrow or I can be replaced by someone younger, cheaper and more * hard working* than me.

Better to work and make money and position while you still can. Thats the reality of the modern world. I don't care about the joneses by do I care about my inability to provide in future.

Old age these days is 3-4 decades, I've seen what happens to people who end up with little money when they are old. It makes me insecure and scared. I am not sure how easy or hard it is to decide to end your life before you are too old, I am guessing its not easy to convince yourself.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#153

Post by grasshopperpurp »

konschubert wrote: post #59
Joeri wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The libertarian argument would be that if government didn’t regulate working hours the number of hours worked vs the amount of pay would be negotiated by the labor market and you would be free to choose to work fewer hours in exchange for somewhat reduced pay. The socialist counter-argument would be that under such a system people with few employment options or low skills would be forced to work more hours for the sa…

I don't think it's illegal, in any western country, to work part time. So we HAVE the option to negotiate fewer hours, no?

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying, 'How does the libertarian argument (removing regulation) improve a worker's ability to negotiate.' Is that correct?

Re: The compelling case for working less

#154

Post by maxxxxx »

funnelsgun wrote: post #115
Spearchucker wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Age fixes that. Used to feel much the same. Now (approaching 50) I just couldn't give a shit anymore. A friend I've grown distant from over the last 4 years or so bought a 911 GT3 RS last year. And suddenly I hear from him. And I marvel at the waste. Purchases like that are meaningful on only two days - the day you buy it, and the day you sell it. I think a mid-20's me might've liked a car like that for the sex it co…

I'd argue that a 911 GT3 RS is not a waste. I would love to own a GT3, let alone a GT3 RS. Most GT3 RS owners are motorsport lovers, and use their GT3 RS for its true purpose. Motorsport and track events are also a great place to make new friends, as are organized road trips to incredible places in the world such as the PetrolHead tours.

The social aspect is true. I made a lot of friends when i took my lotus Elise to track events and other outings.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#155

Post by profalseidol »

dominotw wrote: post #152
spyckie2 wrote: post #7

I'm convinced that our decision for how much effort to exert on work is not governed by the rational part of our brain. It's part primal - fear of insecurity and belonging to a social structure - part ego - accomplishment as confirmation of existence and your salary as a concrete number to compare favorably to others - and part culture and habit. I also think overwork is a byproduct of a globally connected society. H…

I think it has more to do with insecurity about future. Sure I can work less and live a pretty cozy life a software developer. But I have no idea what will happen to my profession and to me in 10 yrs. Who knows if I'd be able to keep up with tech in 10yrs, maybe my brain will slow down. My job can be outsourced tomorrow or I can be replaced by someone younger, cheaper and more * hard working* than me. Better to work…

Reality of capitalism. Work or die! or join them in keeping the masses overworked

Re: The compelling case for working less

#156

Post by dominotw »

profalseidol wrote: post #155
dominotw wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it has more to do with insecurity about future. Sure I can work less and live a pretty cozy life a software developer. But I have no idea what will happen to my profession and to me in 10 yrs. Who knows if I'd be able to keep up with tech in 10yrs, maybe my brain will slow down. My job can be outsourced tomorrow or I can be replaced by someone younger, cheaper and more * hard working* than me. Better to work…

Reality of capitalism. Work or die! or join them in keeping the masses overworked

I think its the reality of humanity. There is always someone more desperate, more hungry than you to take what you have.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#157

Post by alexasmyths »

"When I moved to Rome from Washington, DC, one sight struck me more than any ancient column or grand basilica: people doing nothing."

Yes. It's like a big small town. It's quite refreshing - though it can be frustrating if you want to get something done.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#158

Post by voxl »

raverbashing wrote: post #131
b0rsuk wrote: post #23

One of older articles linked from HN said the very name "stress" is wrong, because it conjures incorrect expectations. That you can forever endure a certain level of pressure, but will break after a certain point. The term "stress" comes from the world of physics. Instead, the article argued, stress resistance is like a muscle. To develop it, you need to exercise it a bit, then STOP. As someone who made working out h…

You won't get overtraining by doing pushups 7 days a week (you shouldn't, but you won't)

If you do 3x12 pushups (or 2x to failure) every single day when your current level is wall pushups you will over train.

There are a lot more people in this world whose level is wall pushups than you may realize.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#159

Post by ataturk »

leaf_mc wrote: post #58

I wrote a blog post on this: https://medium.com/leaf-software/working-too-much-please-sto... The reaction I've had is pretty surprising. A lot of people seem to think it's too difficult for them work less.

I'm having trouble with it--I sincerely want to work less and am financially able to if I so choose. I only want to work part-time to cover modest monthly expenses and health insurance (since employers typically don't pay for or subsidize insurance for part-time workers). I only work full time right now because of health insurance because for my healthy family of four, paying for it myself is a larger nut than my house payment was when I had a mortgage which screws up my FIRE plan.

There just aren't any part-time techie jobs, or else I'm not approaching the problem the right way. After a 2-year contract concluded at the end of 2016, I took three months off and tried to find the part-time work I desire and then I panicked and found an FTE role again.

I don't want to be cashier at Target, I just don't want to be a developer working 40+ hrs. anymore because it's absurd for me to do so but I feel like the risk of retiring so young is too high because once you're out, it's hard to get back in.

I simply want more free time to work on things I care about and not be dictated to regarding when I can take time off or for how long. Again, I am financially able to do this, but either I am psychologically unable, or just haven't put the pieces together yet.

Re: The compelling case for working less

#160

Post by LeifCarrotson »

Spearchucker wrote: post #94
kough wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Humans are happy if they are relatively well off compared to what they know. This is super true. I've been congratulating myself all month on my new job, paying me BIG BUCKS, compared to my friends. Well, just found out an old friend of mine also found a new job, getting payed literally twice as much as me. Now I'm in a funk and it's irrational and stupid but I can't help but look at the same number in a totally di…

Age fixes that. Used to feel much the same. Now (approaching 50) I just couldn't give a shit anymore. A friend I've grown distant from over the last 4 years or so bought a 911 GT3 RS last year. And suddenly I hear from him. And I marvel at the waste. Purchases like that are meaningful on only two days - the day you buy it, and the day you sell it. I think a mid-20's me might've liked a car like that for the sex it co…

Age can both help fix the problem of feeling well-off and exacerbate it.

It's easy to be among the top in something in the little group that a kid in high school is exposed to. Even in a big district, there are enough things to be good at that you can be the best at something esoteric. Then you go to a good college for that thing, and come in thinking you're all that, and suddenly realize that you're average. But college exposes you to the fact that there are innumerable niches in that thing, and you can pick one and be among the best at that niche from your graduating class. You then go off to work, thinking you're hot stuff with your new top-of-the-line special credentials, and think you know more than everyone else in your field. Surprise: You don't. You meet someone who's been in the field for 30 years and can solve the special problems that you're uniquely good at in their sleep. And that guy has someone he calls when he can't figure something out.

It's sort of like looking for records in a baseball game: There are so many possible records to set and precedents to break, that there's something new for the announcers to go on about in most every game. There's a lot of room to be unique, special, and valuable.

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