Live data from Hacker News

When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

masslawblog.com

31–40 of 89 posts

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#31
Option 4.

File a motion asking Judge Alsup to recuse himself (withdraw from the case). A recusal motion may be based on evidence that a judge is biased or lacks impartiality.

Yeh.. the judge has busted us, so he is not impartial because he knows we are guilty...

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#32
post #28

> Uber has a team dedicated to collecting trade secrets from competing companies. Allegedly, the people involved use disappearing-message apps, anonymous servers, and secret computers and phones to communicate without leaving a trail. If true, then this is absolutely unreal. Add it to the growing list of dodgy Uber tactics: Ride-hailing company (Uber) hit by revelations it used custom-built tool to deceive law enforc…

If you implement any of this shit as an engineer and you try to Nuremberg your way out of responsibility, you should be ashamed of yourself.

Hi, what is that debate about Nuremberg? Did it allow to escape responsibility ? Genuinely interested.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#33
post #32
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you implement any of this shit as an engineer and you try to Nuremberg your way out of responsibility, you should be ashamed of yourself.

Hi, what is that debate about Nuremberg? Did it allow to escape responsibility ? Genuinely interested.

Nurenberg is where they held the trials for Nazis after World War II. Many of them claimed that they were only following orders, which quickly became known as the “Nuremberg defense”.

I honestly don’t know to what degree it worked.

It’s obviously quite clear that it’s seen as a cowards way out; that people should have done the right thing in spite of orders.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#34
post #30

I just don’t get why engineers want to work for Uber. They have treated their drivers poorly (eg. under paying them and fighting benefits other cab companies have to pay), their riders poorly (eg. not telling them their personal data was stolen), their engineers poorly (eg. giving zero fucks about sexual harassment without the press getting involved), local governments poorly (eg. dodging law enforcement and regulato…

Integrity is a rare coin these days, but to be fair, it won't buy you much.

I still think it's worthwhile because...you know, be nice to people. But I'm fortunate to be in a position where I can be a sucker like that without serious consequences. I know that having integrity in the current market hurts me a bit, but I can afford it.

Maybe not everyone has that sort of option - maybe Uber's extra $20k keeps their mortgage above water or something. But I dunno, maybe that's also just being charitable. I'm getting pretty disillusioned these days.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#35
post #30

I just don’t get why engineers want to work for Uber. They have treated their drivers poorly (eg. under paying them and fighting benefits other cab companies have to pay), their riders poorly (eg. not telling them their personal data was stolen), their engineers poorly (eg. giving zero fucks about sexual harassment without the press getting involved), local governments poorly (eg. dodging law enforcement and regulato…

So they can make up baseless claims and legally blackmail them for millions of dollars obviously /s.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#36
post #30

I just don’t get why engineers want to work for Uber. They have treated their drivers poorly (eg. under paying them and fighting benefits other cab companies have to pay), their riders poorly (eg. not telling them their personal data was stolen), their engineers poorly (eg. giving zero fucks about sexual harassment without the press getting involved), local governments poorly (eg. dodging law enforcement and regulato…

I personally had to leave a company because women were promoted all the time and men were ostensibly discriminated against. Both ends of the spectrum are annoying, those who don’t care about progressism (Uber), and those who give all power to accusers (90% of SV). If given the choice, I’d work for the workplace that gives me equal chances of promotion and recognizes presumption of innocence against the one which discriminates me (Google et al).

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#37
post #29
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It all comes to personal ethics.

Let's not ignore the group dynamic though either. People's moral convictions can be somewhat flexible when it comes to fitting in and blending in with a group, including a company. Yes it's true that if your personal ethics are strong enough, you'll resist or exit a group whose ethics conflict with your own. It's also true that if the company has good ethics, you won't have to. Meanwhile the weak-minded as Obi Wan mi…

This is very true. Thanks for this comment, group dynamics might in fact be more important than personal ethics.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#38
post #32
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you implement any of this shit as an engineer and you try to Nuremberg your way out of responsibility, you should be ashamed of yourself.

Hi, what is that debate about Nuremberg? Did it allow to escape responsibility ? Genuinely interested.

It’s seen as a cowardly defense in that you argue against any personal resonsibility for something you were ordered to do.

In the particular case of the Nuremberg tribunals, no the superior orders defense did not work because the Allies had jointly decided to not allow it. However, during the My Lai massacre of 1968 US soldiers successfully used the defense to reduce their sentences when they were court martialed.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#39
post #30

I just don’t get why engineers want to work for Uber. They have treated their drivers poorly (eg. under paying them and fighting benefits other cab companies have to pay), their riders poorly (eg. not telling them their personal data was stolen), their engineers poorly (eg. giving zero fucks about sexual harassment without the press getting involved), local governments poorly (eg. dodging law enforcement and regulato…

Integrity is a rare coin these days, but to be fair, it won't buy you much. I still think it's worthwhile because...you know, be nice to people. But I'm fortunate to be in a position where I can be a sucker like that without serious consequences. I know that having integrity in the current market hurts me a bit, but I can afford it. Maybe not everyone has that sort of option - maybe Uber's extra $20k keeps their mort…

Integrity is always an option, but it's definitely not always an easy option. I'm glad you're in a place where you don't have to test it and hope that I also won't find myself in a difficult place where it will have to be tested, but I do know that it's the only coin that is really worth anything.

Re: When the Judge Distrusts Your Lawyers

#40
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Integrity is a rare coin these days, but to be fair, it won't buy you much. I still think it's worthwhile because...you know, be nice to people. But I'm fortunate to be in a position where I can be a sucker like that without serious consequences. I know that having integrity in the current market hurts me a bit, but I can afford it. Maybe not everyone has that sort of option - maybe Uber's extra $20k keeps their mort…

Integrity is always an option, but it's definitely not always an easy option. I'm glad you're in a place where you don't have to test it and hope that I also won't find myself in a difficult place where it will have to be tested, but I do know that it's the only coin that is really worth anything.

Yeah, exactly. It's also much easier when you have a hierarchy that communicates and responds reasonably to criticism or questions.

Not everyone does, though. I feel like insurance companies should really start demanding independent 'inspector general' sort of offices to be retained by companies above a certain value. At some point, there just gets to be too much money at stake to trust people to act properly.

Some companies actually are starting to invest in that sort of thing, mostly because of all of the sexual harassment news flying around. I think it's a promising idea, to give employees a point of contact outside the company's usual chain of command, and it could help with all sorts of toxic power imbalances. I can also see how it could maybe cause issues, but I'm all for trying new things to see how they work.

Post reply on HN