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Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

sfchronicle.com

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Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#61

Post by namelezz »

mcguire wrote: post #37
crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our society is culturally configured to promote lying here. Instead of addressing the issue openly like adults, people decide to operate covertly, driven by competition and fear of missing out. It'll be nice when we start to culturally grow up a bit and begin trusting the world. Collaboration/hybridization is much quicker than competition when it comes to genetic evolution & I suspect the same holds for cultural evol…

So, to start with, shut down the rules against discussing salaries or university costs with coworkers and other students, respectively.

> So, to start with, shut down the rules against discussing salaries or university costs with coworkers and other students, respectively.

No, this will expose evidences of institutional and systemic racism and question people about the country name. Should it be United State or Segregated State?

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#62

Post by jamesrcole »

crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #35
jknz wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, lies are unacceptable. To play devil's advocate here: the press and the public do not want to hear that tech companies pay 7 digits of monthly salary to attract some talent. Nor do they want to hear that Universities have to offer merit based scholarships to attract top students, otherwise these students will go elsewhere. Companies advertise their diversity efforts but not the salaries of their executives. Stanf…

Our society is culturally configured to promote lying here. Instead of addressing the issue openly like adults, people decide to operate covertly, driven by competition and fear of missing out. It'll be nice when we start to culturally grow up a bit and begin trusting the world. Collaboration/hybridization is much quicker than competition when it comes to genetic evolution & I suspect the same holds for cultural evol…

One issue I think we need to address is how society basically judges things based on sound-bite descriptions of them. This is an area where I think IT can contribute, by trying to find ways to bias our communication technologies against such practices.

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#63

Post by [deleted] »

kelukelugames wrote: post #42
wyager wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you offer diversity-based scholarships as opposed to need-based, you don’t actually select for the people who are disadvantaged because of their background; you select for people who are not disadvantaged and incidentally have a background that may disadvantage other people. If your goal is to help disadvantaged people, you should be giving out some combination of need- and merit- based scholarships.

I somewhat agree with the first part. That's why most of Harvard's black students are first or second generation African immigrants. I have Nigerian friends who joke about being Nigerian princes because, well, they kind of are. The second part assumes class is the only disadvantage. Perhaps preference for poorer student is the only type of affirmative action accepted by both major US political parties. And I agree mo…

[deleted]

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#64

Post by Spooky23 »

wenc wrote: post #50
Spooky23 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Find a community college with a 2-2 combo program with a school with a good name. Buy your daughter a nice car. She’ll get a better education, have a car at graduation and you will save a lot of money.

What are some examples of those? I can think of only one: UCLA is a popular transfer school for folks with 2 years of CC.

Look for “program to program transfer”.

Here’s an example from a community college near where I grew up.

http://www.hvcc.edu/career-transfer/transfer/articulation_by...

The value varies by major. A good friend of mine went from the engineering sciences major to SUNY Binghamton or Buffalo, where he got an engineering BS and a paid co-op. He ended up paying very little, had no debt, and had a network right out of school to get a job for his PE. Then He started his own engineering practice.

Some state universities have partnerships with other schools for masters programs too. My school had a 3-2 masters program where you’d end up with a state BS/BA and an MS in engineering or sciences from a another school, sometimes public sometimes private.

The nice thing about program transfers vs a normal transfer is that there are no surprises. All of your general education and in-major requirements are met. Anecdotally, it’s a better experience for some majors because the larger universities usually consider teaching a distraction, and you get better instructors and smaller classes for in-major stuff in the CC. Intro to CS in my state school was a hazing ritual designed to reduce a group of 600 students down to 300 for the spring. At the CC, it’s 30-40 kids.

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#66

Post by curiousgal »

Waterluvian wrote: post #27
ringaroundthetx wrote: post #21

One of my favorite realizations is that more things are free when you have money. People just want your business. It’s expensive being poor.

Payday loans, credit card interest. Financing plans. Being poor is cripplingly expensive.

Credit cards are the one thing I can’t wrap my head around. I am not American and most of my young U.S. friends I met early in college were so excited about having a credit score of x which entitled them to more debt...

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#67

Post by brudgers »

kelukelugames wrote: post #34

Stanfurd can favor students born on a blue moon with an extra nipple for all I care. But claiming all scholarships are need based, giving them to rich students, and then telling students to not discuss their aid is disgusting. In my book this is on par with the wage fixing between Apple and the other tech giants. This is the downside of diversity and inclusion. Companies and schools have gotten so good at paying lip…

The diversity receiving lip service here is economic diversity. Wealth always comes with privilege and social standing. Reading this as social diversity ignores the possibility that lower economic status is associated with greater diversity...in a statistically random world this is an equal possibility.

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#68

Post by ZeroGravitas »

plandis wrote: post #19
shas3 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The argument for diversity as a good investment: 1. With high-income whites some dumb blokes may sneak in due to privilege and winging it based on family connections, etc. This might be happening at the expense of spunky smart low income whites or blacks who worked harder and were smarter to overcome their disadvantage to get to a point where they’re in the pool of those being considered for admission into Stanford.…

Yeah but gender and race diversity (the qualifications mentioned in the article) still discriminate against poor white males. I am fairly certain that a poor white guy would have a very different perspective from one who grew up in a life of privilege but that socioeconomic diversity doesn’t look as good I guess.

> Yeah but gender and race diversity (the qualifications mentioned in the article) still discriminate against poor white males.

Am I the only one to notice that HN goes full communist when, and only when, affirmative action for minorities and women is the topic.

Those poor white men don't really get mentioned much otherwise.

Re: Stanford University data glitch exposes truth about scholarships

#70

Post by mcguire »

asimpletune wrote: post #60
mcguire wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, to start with, shut down the rules against discussing salaries or university costs with coworkers and other students, respectively.

I don’t know if there are rules against that. I think it’s more an unspoken rule that may have consequences if violated, although I’m fairly certain that’s illegal. The impetus is more on us to be open with each other about salary. It’s only in the company’s best interest for us not to do so.

According to the article,

"[Allcock’s report] says the school also tells applicants not to reveal to their classmates the size of their discount."

Unwritten or unspoken, it does need to go.

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