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“I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

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Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#81

Post by netsharc »

ramtatatam wrote: post #10

In your country do you have to register the business if your business does not make any money? In UK you can make money for 3 months before registering... I feel for you, I can only give you an advice to try to turn your mind into anything positive. You are lucky you don't have kids to feed, or pregnant wife to look after. Robert Kiyosaki has written in 'Rich dad poor dad' book, that it's good to default before 30 so…

I've read Kiyosaki's book, but people have claimed he's exaggerating about his successes; if he's so successful why is he on TV trying so hard to sell his books, board games, and courses? And the 2 dads didn't really exist, they're figures he made up.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#82

Post by ricardobeat »

thelittleone wrote: post #60
bufferoverflow wrote: post #9

Yeah, quitting the job with no savings is a mistake. The things he could have done better are mainly 1) Proof that people want to play this game. Post the gameplay video on /r/indiegaming, see what people say. I remember the early days of Minecraft, people went wild for it, even though it was very basic. 2) Marketing. Tweeting is not enough. Submitting to reviewers is not enough. On the positive side, he is fast and…

I quit my job a few years back with around $150k in the bank to fund my startup. A few months later, still nervous about leaving full time employment, I took a job interview with a big four. I received an offer with a base salary of $600k. I turned that down and committed to the startup. A few months on, I receive a letter from the tax department advising that my previous employer provided corrected earnings informat…

Why not take the job for a year or two and have a (half) million to fund your startup?

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#83

Post by dkersten »

tobltobs wrote: post #68
cousin_it wrote: post #49

His sense of what games are "cool" wasn't in tune with the public. That's the cardinal sin. Pixel art dungeon crawlers aren't cool. It's as if he was a musician and decided to release a glam metal album today. Low budget, poor marketing, uncooperative bureaucracy - nah dude, none of that matters, you're just too in love with glam metal and people aren't buying glam metal.

That is called "targeting a niche" and makes sense if you can't compete against those big marketing budgets. Even the glam metal niche is still alive: hairmetalheaven.co.uk

But you need to make sure the niche is large enough to support your financial needs and that they want what you're making. Did he talk to his target audience or otherwise pre-qualify his niche? Also, did he promote his game or just rely on Steam? There is so much on Steam these days, what did he do to stand out?

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#84

Post by dirktheman »

tobltobs wrote: post #68
cousin_it wrote: post #49

His sense of what games are "cool" wasn't in tune with the public. That's the cardinal sin. Pixel art dungeon crawlers aren't cool. It's as if he was a musician and decided to release a glam metal album today. Low budget, poor marketing, uncooperative bureaucracy - nah dude, none of that matters, you're just too in love with glam metal and people aren't buying glam metal.

That is called "targeting a niche" and makes sense if you can't compete against those big marketing budgets. Even the glam metal niche is still alive: hairmetalheaven.co.uk

Nothing wrong with targeting a niche, IF the niche is willing to pay a hefty sum for their needs. In this case he sold 90 copies on Steam, I think that every pixel art dungeon crawler fanatic on Steam has a copy now.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#86

Post by ninjaroar »

thelittleone wrote: post #60
bufferoverflow wrote: post #9

Yeah, quitting the job with no savings is a mistake. The things he could have done better are mainly 1) Proof that people want to play this game. Post the gameplay video on /r/indiegaming, see what people say. I remember the early days of Minecraft, people went wild for it, even though it was very basic. 2) Marketing. Tweeting is not enough. Submitting to reviewers is not enough. On the positive side, he is fast and…

I quit my job a few years back with around $150k in the bank to fund my startup. A few months later, still nervous about leaving full time employment, I took a job interview with a big four. I received an offer with a base salary of $600k. I turned that down and committed to the startup. A few months on, I receive a letter from the tax department advising that my previous employer provided corrected earnings informat…

600k base salary? What type of position is that?

Developer salaries in the big four (I assume you mean Google/Facebook/Amazon/Apple) are high but that is still twice what I normally hear (and have gotten offers for), and that's assuming you're talking about total comp. I'm not doubting you, i'm just curious what type of experience you need to get that.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#87

Post by speedplane »

ninjaroar wrote: post #86
thelittleone wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I quit my job a few years back with around $150k in the bank to fund my startup. A few months later, still nervous about leaving full time employment, I took a job interview with a big four. I received an offer with a base salary of $600k. I turned that down and committed to the startup. A few months on, I receive a letter from the tax department advising that my previous employer provided corrected earnings informat…

600k base salary? What type of position is that? Developer salaries in the big four (I assume you mean Google/Facebook/Amazon/Apple) are high but that is still twice what I normally hear (and have gotten offers for), and that's assuming you're talking about total comp. I'm not doubting you, i'm just curious what type of experience you need to get that.

If I had a nickle every time a HN commenter said they make 500k+/yr as an engineer, I'd make 500k+/yr.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#88

Post by joshvm »

cousin_it wrote: post #49

His sense of what games are "cool" wasn't in tune with the public. That's the cardinal sin. Pixel art dungeon crawlers aren't cool. It's as if he was a musician and decided to release a glam metal album today. Low budget, poor marketing, uncooperative bureaucracy - nah dude, none of that matters, you're just too in love with glam metal and people aren't buying glam metal.

The pixel art thing is quite trendy if the game is also good. Good Night Knight has been getting a lot of hype recently: http://knightdev.tumblr.com/

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#89

Post by mindfulplay »

The main advice should be: not another pixel art game. Please. We have enough of these. Folks let's move on from the 1970s.

Also this is getting tired seeing honest, hard-working, self-motivated talented individuals push themselves into the same tried and tested crappy old corner of 'indie pixel art games'. It's quite difficult to see anything innovative or even remotely enjoyable from this genre anymore.

It's not Romania. It's not boring buearacracy. Its not the savings. Hell it's not even you.

It's pixel art crap that passes off as indie games. I hate AAA games but now I hate these indie pixel art games even more.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#90

Post by teniutza »

photonios wrote: post #44
ccozan wrote: post #25

The country he mentions is Romania. Well, bureaucracy is high, but like other said, no need to setup a company in advance. But, he saved anyway way to little money ( I found strange that he is counting in USD, since euro is de facto currency, besides the RON ) to be able to sustain him and an apartment. Lessons learn: don't quit your job until you have some sale volume. However, since he's in Romania, he will get a j…

That highly depends on which city you are in Romania. If you're in one of the bigger cities (Bucharest, Cluj, Iasi or Oradea) then it's going to be ok. If not, then you're screwed, unless you can work remote. At least, that has been my experience. There's also the thing that the average developer salaries are surprisingly low. They are well above the national average, but it's only the top 1-5% who really pulls in th…

Do you have any (online) references available for the average salaries? I'm quite interested in this but can't seem to find decent sources...
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