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“I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

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Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#61
post #32

He should mention it's essentially reboot of the classic Dungeon Master game, that was a very popular title, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungeon_Master_(video_game)

I didn't see the game as that, but now that you mentioned it you actually pushed me into buying the game and finding out if your claim is true :) Dungeon Master was one of my favourite games growing up (Amiga version). Scared the crap out of me at times.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#62
post #45

What gets me about this is the tiny scale of things. This is the first time it really dawns on me just how small of a success a game might have to be and still have the developer going (hard as it may be to reach 700 sold, apparently). Honestly, this puts things into an entirely new light for me. I feel like buying, playing and then thoroughly interacting in the community of a game can really have personal impact on…

That's when your developer is in Romania. If your game developer lives in bay area, that's a full order of magnitude of difference in cost of living.

The developer said he had four months of savings. And then he said $500 of expenses cost him a whole month.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#63
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) It's very hard to get proof for good, but not exceptional games. Getting any feedback is hard. Minecraft was unique, it will likely get to a quarter billion sold copies eventually, it's not the game you want to compare your 3-month project to.

It always saddens me when people claim Minecraft was unique, because it was actually a clone of Infiniminer [0] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwM6OA9DkXI

GP presumably means that its financial success was unique. They're not talking about gameplay.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#65
post #51

I don't understand how people still think that just creating and publishing a game is enough to sell enough copies or make a living from it. Maybe a few years back, that barely worked, but even then, if you didn't have an audience, your game never sold as much.

> I don't understand how people still think that just creating and publishing a game is enough to sell enough copies or make a living from it. Back in the 80s even the crappiest games sold relatively well. Infogrames made a whole publishing company out of it.

Okay, but the 80s are a bit more than a few years back. When the market is basically empty, i.e. the demand is high, any product will sell somewhat.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#66
post #28

Quitting your job with only 4 month worth of savings, with a new mortgage, to enter an industry known for its oversaturation, extreme competition, and high luck element for indies ? That's insane. Maybe I'm just risk-adverse. That said, I think he actually succeeded, despite appearances. Managing to release a working game in 3 month, that actually got sales, is a feat in itself. The game will keep trickling sales, if…

When I started my company like 10 years ago, I also had savings for only like 4 months. However my plan was not to do games specifically but anything that pays the bills. Though I made one game as well but more like for fun and training, not for money. My various products did little money, though I had to look for gigs quite often to support the development. After 1-2 years I made enough money from the products so that I didn't need the gigs any more.

As a developer it is quite easy to find contracting/freelancing gigs if you need money quickly. I don't know in what kind of business environment this guy lives, but I've never felt that those with programming skills need to stress about savings that much, because there is so much short-term work available if you want it. Of course it is not the kind of work that many would want to do, but it pays the bills.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#67
post #54
post #28

Quitting your job with only 4 month worth of savings, with a new mortgage, to enter an industry known for its oversaturation, extreme competition, and high luck element for indies ? That's insane. Maybe I'm just risk-adverse. That said, I think he actually succeeded, despite appearances. Managing to release a working game in 3 month, that actually got sales, is a feat in itself. The game will keep trickling sales, if…

Yes, it's very impressive, and the purpose of the whole post IMO is part of the marketing (call me evil). Also if he didn't quit his job, he probably wouldn't be able to get this far within a year.

He was only a month away from completing the game when he quit. If he'd worked evenings and weekends, and used some vacation time, it seems like he could have easily finished and released the game by early next year. That way he wouldn't have to bet everything on the "magic unicorn" of instant Steam success.

I sometimes think people starting businesses take on an unnecessary amount of risk out of some unconscious belief that, by doing so, it will "prove" to God or the universe, or maybe just themselves, that they really want it.

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#68

His sense of what games are "cool" wasn't in tune with the public. That's the cardinal sin. Pixel art dungeon crawlers aren't cool. It's as if he was a musician and decided to release a glam metal album today. Low budget, poor marketing, uncooperative bureaucracy - nah dude, none of that matters, you're just too in love with glam metal and people aren't buying glam metal.

That is called "targeting a niche" and makes sense if you can't compete against those big marketing budgets. Even the glam metal niche is still alive: hairmetalheaven.co.uk

Re: “I thought I could ship at least 700 units to stay in business”

#69

Yeah, quitting the job with no savings is a mistake. The things he could have done better are mainly 1) Proof that people want to play this game. Post the gameplay video on /r/indiegaming, see what people say. I remember the early days of Minecraft, people went wild for it, even though it was very basic. 2) Marketing. Tweeting is not enough. Submitting to reviewers is not enough. On the positive side, he is fast and…

I quit my job a few years back with around $150k in the bank to fund my startup. A few months later, still nervous about leaving full time employment, I took a job interview with a big four. I received an offer with a base salary of $600k. I turned that down and committed to the startup. A few months on, I receive a letter from the tax department advising that my previous employer provided corrected earnings informat…

I think us IT'ers feel somewhat buffered in life just by the fact that it's quite possible to get job offers with $600k salaries...
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