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Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

nytimes.com

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Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#61

Post by rdtsc »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #50
Wonnk13 wrote: post #44

Living in Maryland, I've met several young people who put in a few years at the agency (including TAO) who then left for industry. Millenials don't care about a government pension, especially when you're in a windowless SCIF hacking Perl. The US Government as a whole has a massive talent retention problem. Only the mediocre will stay at NSA / CIA now and we'll probably see more of these leaks / hacks.

Wait, they use perl?

Well mostly Python for scripting. But it might be 2.4 running on RHEL 5 or something silly like that.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#62

Post by milofeynman »

azinman2 wrote: post #49
Wonnk13 wrote: post #44

Living in Maryland, I've met several young people who put in a few years at the agency (including TAO) who then left for industry. Millenials don't care about a government pension, especially when you're in a windowless SCIF hacking Perl. The US Government as a whole has a massive talent retention problem. Only the mediocre will stay at NSA / CIA now and we'll probably see more of these leaks / hacks.

There’s a massive pay disparity between public and private, and those currently in power want to keep it that way and eat away even more at gov functions. That combined without a clear rallying call for public service (like the Cold War or collective pride) are a recipe for disaster.

Until this is fixed we'll continue to be reliant on Israel intelligence

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#63

Post by kurthr »

natch wrote: post #17

One thing that is not talked about enough with NSA is that if they are capable of leaking some of their most sensitive and powerful tools, then they are also capable of leaking the most sensitive and private information they collect on people. Perhaps this has not yet happened, or perhaps it has (someone will no doubt point out any known incidents here if there are any) but the idea is unnerving. Maybe my wording is…

Yes, and the corollary to that any foreign power that wants to spy on Americans need only focus on a single point of failure... our own security apparatus. It would be much more difficult to develop the data collection, storage, and management of that data on their own. We have paid to do it to our selves.

Now maybe there are counter espionage methods developed... but the idea that our geopolitical competitors don't have a single other mole as a contractor with Snowden's level of access is no longer (and frankly never was) credible. You could probably make a similar argument about our advertising apparatus.

Never develop a tool/weapon you can't afford to be used against you, because in the long term it will.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#64

Post by chiefalchemist »

paulmd wrote: post #52
chiefalchemist wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's true. The concern should be Trump's sense of priorities. He's so easily distracted. He's seemingly more focused on Twitter than the NSA. He, similar to Obama, is the wrong "leader" at the wrong time. We're off course and getting more and more so with each day.

The North Korean nucelear+missile programs are a tangible example of how Obama was the right leader. Under Obama these programs spun their wheels without traction for 8 solid years thanks to a huge amount of covert action from our intelligence agencies. Missiles blew up, centrifuges didn't work, etc, and all with little to no loss of American life. Under Trump they are not taken seriously and they have made significa…

> "People don't appreciate how many things were quietly going right under Obama..."

Yes, but quietly works both ways.

- Fracking hockey stick'ed on Obama's watch. In the context of climate change that's unimaginable.

- Wall Street consolidated it's power (8 major banks down to 7) and there was no significant response. Not single WS exec was prosecuted after the 2008 crash.

- The usage of drones - built by the MIC led by the CIA - increased as a proxy for foreign policy under Obama. Those civilian deaths, of which there are plenty, will eventually come back to haunt the USA.

- Snowden happened on Obama's watch and the response... (editorial) I don't feel any safer, nor my rights any more protected.

- BLM was on BO's watch and plenty of influential figures have been critical of Obama's response.

- Flint MI happened on Obama's watch. A local issue perhaps but when the greatest country in the history of the world poisons its own with lead and the POTUS just gives another "that's not who we are speech" something isn't right.

Finally, the USA empire has been on the decline for sometime. Neither Trump nor HRC were going to stop that slide.

I'm not picking on Obama. He did a good job all in all. What concerns me is how willing the media has been not to paint the complete picture on some very significant issues / events. Things that will having a long lasting impact on the future of the USA, as well as the world.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#65

Post by FooHentai »

mirimir wrote: post #39
larkeith wrote: post #4

Cause for celebration for all who support privacy and security.

I get the sentiment. But now the tools are available to more criminals. And that's hardly good, is it?

Yes, it's great. Public availability of these tools means the exploits they leverage will be swiftly mitigated. They will be of no use to criminals, outside of the narrow window between disclosure and mitigation.

Had the NSA acted with integrity and disclosed these vulnerabilities rather than hoarding them, that window would be even smaller.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#66

Post by chiefalchemist »

0xbear wrote: post #38
chiefalchemist wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you suggesting running a company is the same as leading a country? As for the election, history says otherwise. DNC incompetence as well as Clinton arrogance all but handed Trump & Co the win. In addition, the fact that a "political unknown" was able to bubble to the top of the GOP ticket is more of an indictment of that party than any significant skill on Trump's part. Who did he beat? Cruz? Rubio? That's a notw…

Where did I suggest that? And you try to beat Cruz or Rubio (let alone “arrogant” Clinton and the entirety of mainstream press), and then come here and tell us if it’s a noteworthy accomplishment.

Um. You're telling me the party that had 7+ years to plan for the repeal & replace of ACA but completely failed at that has able leadership? Those who campaigned for the ticket was the cream of the GOP crop. They're not competent. How is Trump punching his way out of a wet paper bag a sign of significance?

I'm being snarky. I'm curious as to how anyone can see the rest of the GOP'ers that tried to get the nomination as being worthy or it.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#67

Post by chickenbane »

dasil003 wrote: post #14

I don't think it's exactly right to say they should have focused on defense. The first mistake was focusing on installing a surveillance apparatus and using fear mongering to sell it politically while giving short thrift to the actual principles justifying the decision. In doing so they lost the moral high ground and opened the door for Snowdens and worse. I'm not saying the NSA has ever been a paragon of ethics, but…

I disagree; it's a focus of their existence that appears to be abandoned by the NSA - and that's dearly needed right now.

From the front page of nsa.gov: "Defending our Nation. Securing the Future." The second point from their What we do page - "Defends vital networks". In the opening paragraph of Wikipedia: "The NSA is also tasked with the protection of U.S. communications networks and information systems". Etc.

For all the prestige of the TAO, who claims that the US networks are secure and well defended?

I read the news and see the nation's voting, power, media, and other critical infrastructure are all being hacked. Notably Equifax, a steward of all Americans most valuable information, was compromised in trivial fashion.

Our peers working at Google, Facebook, Twitter, etc are being attacked nonstop by foreign actors and they are rightfully being held to account by congress. But in my opinion the social networks are secondary compared to the primary infrastructure that honestly does not have access to the best talent should be aided by NSA.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#68

Post by meowface »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #26
sebcat wrote: post #3

> The agency regarded as the world’s leader in breaking into adversaries’ computer networks failed to protect its own. Those are two very different things. Focusing on one of them doesn't automatically benefit your efforts on the other.

NSA is also responsible for establishing computer security practices for the rest of the government to follow. That they don't eat their own dogfood is damning.

They do typically eat their own dogfood when it comes to the security practices they propose. Dual_EC_DRBG is the big exception, but it's generally considered that most of the rest of their cryptographic standards are secure and suitable for public and government use.

There are likely many conflicting departments and teams within NSA. Many are probably trying to fight for the public's security and have for years, with cryptographers earnestly trying to develop secure and efficient algorithms. They are probably at odds with the other forces in the organization that seek to play the espionage game, even if it puts the country at risk.

Re: Security Breach and Spilled Secrets Have Shaken the N.S.A.

#69

Post by SmooL »

jhiska wrote: post #51

Proves that no computer network can be secured, and is specially interesting given that the entire US military is moving to operate as a giant computer network where everyone is a node in the system. They're setting themselves up for a hack so devastating that it will bring down their own country.

I think that it proves that it's _difficult_ to secure a computer network, not that it's impossible.
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