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The Disappearing American Grad Student

nytimes.com

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Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#51

Post by screye »

ironchef253 wrote: post #30

A few things: Grad students from foreign countries are not crippled with debt. They get affordable educations and can afford to be in school longer in America. Comparable American students have been consumed by debt and must get real jobs to pay it off. If undergrads were paying $7K / year for those degrees instead of $50k, things would be very different. Second, universities who are rich from plundering their underg…

$100k for grad school is not affordable for an Asian when annual family income is $5-10k and interest rates on loans are 15%.

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#52

Post by winslow »

seltzered_ wrote: post #18
jdlyga wrote: post #3

I'm an American, and I just started graduate school. Georgia Tech OMSCS. Very nice program.

Are you doing OMSCS while working? I feel like many are doing these programs while employed & having their employer sponsor them.

Not OP but I am also in OMSCS.

Yes, I am doing OMSCS while working. However, my current employer doesn't have tuition reimbursement. Though if you employer does cover tuition (like a previous employer of mine) you could absolutely get it for no cost to the student.

Also yes you are correct in many are pursuing the degree while employed. Usually taking 1 class per semester.

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#53

Post by winslow »

jdlyga wrote: post #3

I'm an American, and I just started graduate school. Georgia Tech OMSCS. Very nice program.

Fellow Georgia Tech OMSCS student! I'm currently taking Reinforcement Learning (CS 7642). It's a pretty great program and have enjoyed balancing work with 1 class per semester.

Best of luck and power through the last 1/3 of the semester + finals!

Edit: FYI for those curious the OMSCS degree will cost most students $8,110 (10 classes * $811 semester).[1]

[1] https://www.omscs.gatech.edu/program-info/cost-payment-sched... $510 tuition + $301 (fees) = $811 semester

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#54

Post by netheril96 »

I see the chance to draw lottery twice in H1B visa mentioned, but a more important benefit is the OPT visa. Any STEM graduates from an American school can apply for this visa, which lasts for about two years. During this two years you can work and draw the lotteries repeatedly.

For some of us, the major value proposition of a MS degree in US is not its teaching, but the gateway to US employment market. Those luckily born in the US doesn’t need to spend time and money on such privileges.

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#55

Post by known »

The Economist found that between 2012 and 2015 the three biggest Indian outsourcing firms—TCS, Wipro and Infosys—submitted over 150,000 visa applications for positions that paid a median salary of $69,500. In contrast, America’s five biggest tech firms—Apple, Amazon, Facebook, Google and Microsoft—submitted just 31,000 applications, and proposed to pay their workers a median salary of $117,000

http://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21716630-not-goo...

https://qz.com/889524/the-us-says-oracle-is-encouraging-indi...

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#56

Post by jordanb »

ajdlinux wrote: post #9
jdlyga wrote: post #3

I'm an American, and I just started graduate school. Georgia Tech OMSCS. Very nice program.

It's interesting - when OMSCS started, there was so much speculation that it would be flooded with overseas students who would use it to get a cheap US degree that would ultimately help them to migrate. Instead, OMSCS actually has a far, far higher proportion of American students than GATech's on-campus MSCS program...

If you're an international student, a physical presence in the US is one of the things you're buying with your grad school tuition.

Conversely American grad school attendees are mostly career switchers who already have an established life in a place that's probably not Atlanta.

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#57

Post by taurath »

screye wrote: post #50
kristopolous wrote: post #16

They make a single mention of what could be a significant contributing factor; student debt. A quick google search for India and China show that many of their top public universities charge ~$300 and ~$800/year while UC Berkeley is over $14,000. After 4 years, with on-campus housing the first year, the Berkeley student owes about $72,000 while the Indian student owes $1,200. As far as the income differences between t…

I think I should give you direct values, instead of simple speculation. I am masters student in one of the US citizens, and am being funded by my parents savings, so this is all very relevant. I grew up in an above middle class Indian household with an income of about $10,000 a year. My parents lived very frugally (I lived in possibly the highest Indian COL area) and my parents started saving early. Over about 25 yea…

It’s very sad actually that in the US my parents saved absolutely nothing for college because when my one parent that attended did it they could afford it with a summer job.

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#58

Post by sungx105 »

tyoma wrote: post #38

The monetary value proposition of grad school simply isn't very good if you're a US citizen. There is non-monetary value (like advancing human knowledge) that makes grad school worth it for some, but the pay is low. Imagine you just graduated from a quality undergrad with high grades and strong recommendations from your professors. Maybe you had an internship or two or spent a summer doing research. Maybe you even ha…

Your option 1 is incomplete. It should read more closely to:

You go to grad school and spend ~6 years working extremely long hours at nearly minimum wage with no benefits. You then spend 2-3 years on a postdoc still with relatively low compensation. There still are far too few academic positions available. You now either become an adjunct (and get caught in that vicious cycle) or you do another postdoc. Repeat ad nauseum (or until you give up and move to industry anyway)

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#59

Post by chrisseaton »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #48
tanilama wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those programs, with the mentioned quality would not be cheap. But that might be true for US citizens, because usually the school charges less from them. I think I missed somewhat the definition of the grad school here. Majority of the grad students come here for Masters not PhDs, and for the former, the stuff you mentioned, like smaller classes, interaction with professors cannot really be taken for granted, and fro…

The stuff I mentioned was true for both masters students and PhDs (they were in the same classes), but it may vary by field.

PhD students don’t take ‘classes’ - they do their own independent research. It’s a research degree. If someone else can teach you a class on it then it’s clearly not cutting edge enough to do a PhD on!

Re: The Disappearing American Grad Student

#60

Post by laichzeit0 »

tyoma wrote: post #38

The monetary value proposition of grad school simply isn't very good if you're a US citizen. There is non-monetary value (like advancing human knowledge) that makes grad school worth it for some, but the pay is low. Imagine you just graduated from a quality undergrad with high grades and strong recommendations from your professors. Maybe you had an internship or two or spent a summer doing research. Maybe you even ha…

Why not go for Option 2, but do your post-grad part time while working? It might take 10 years instead of 6, but by then you'd have 10 years work experience, capital, etc.
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