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Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

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101–110 of 154 posts

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#101
post #94
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand that this is illegal. What I don't understand is why domestic manipulation of elections isn't. Eric Schmidt and Rupert Murdoch don't have the interests of the US in mind any more then Putin does. Just because it's quite precedented doesn't make it right.

>domestic manipulation of elections You mean campaigning?

Rupert Murdoch isn't himself running for president, but it's pretty clear that he is trying to manipulate the election into a particular outcome.

All the same arguments for why Putin's involvement should be illegal can also be levied against him.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#102

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It i…

Yeah, I remember the outrage when the original Diebold hacking announcement was made in the Bush Jr era. The concerns in that were never addressed and doubtless things have simply since got worse. If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election, they could bring some of their engineering prowess to bear on defeating systematic voting machine fraud.

Everyone wants in on the exiting problem solving portion of the the issue, few people are willing (or have the time available) to sit in on the vote process and procedure oriented bureaucratic election bodies, even fewer still are allowed to be appointed onto the boards that aren't vetted by the major parties.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#103
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most countries have centralised voter registration Most democracies haven't lasted more than a century. De-centralisation is an annoying but core feature of American democracy. It's wise to be conservative when discussing its dismissal, particularly in respect of something as fundamental as voting.

Was America actually a democracy prior to the voting rights act of 1965? (Not trolling, this is a critical part of the issue, the extent to which black people could actually participate in said democracy)

And by extension: Is it a democracy right now? Seeing as a good portion of convicted felons are not allowed to vote.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_disenfranchisement#Curr...

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would take a Constitutional Amendment to get rid of the Electoral College. That’s 2/3rd of both houses of Congress and 2/3rds of the State legislatures. Better to call a third Constitutional Convention.

The unfortunate irony is that 2/3 of state legislatures will never vote to abolish the electoral college in favor of the popular vote, because a vast majority of states get relatively more voting power than they would with the popular vote, since every state gets a minimum of 3 electoral votes no matter how small their population is. This comes at the expense of the few most populous states (e.g. California), which a…

My own state of Vermont has signed on to this [1] particular proposition, so no, not every tiny state demands that it have a voice disproportionate with its size.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Intersta...

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#105
post #77
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your own links say that it happens, but then hand wave it away as not significant. Your [1]: >However, in only 26 cases was there a conviction or a guilty plea by the citizen. From your [2]: >n the state of Washington, for example, six cases of double voting and nineteen instances of individuals voting in the name of the dead yielded twenty-five fraudulent votes From your [3]: >Although Republican activists have repe…

Very few people object to the concept of voter ID. They object to its implementation in the US, which is virtually always done to disenfranchise legitimate voters. The fight against voter ID laws is really a fight against voter laws accompanied by biased ID requirements and intentional difficulties foisted on the opposition voters.

How exactly can you have a citizen that is unable to get a government-issued ID? That is a failure of the government. They either have the documents and/or government records to prove that they are a citizen, or they're not a citizen.

A law requiring citizens to have IDs to vote is not the problem. The problem is the processes that aren't assisting citizens that struggle to get IDs.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#106
post #82
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It doesn't get charged often because there are parties that fight tooth and nail to prevent the implementation of processes You're literally fabricating that. Bluntly,you made this up unless you can provide proof to the contrary. There have been numerous studies that have shown that in person voter fraud is basically non-existent in the US. Think about the motivation for a moment. Committing this crime has negligib…

That's not the only form of vote fraud. Non-citizens voting is illegal and happens[1]. Does it happen in massive numbers? No idea, probably not. To what extent, though, does it compare to eligible voters who don't have ID, which is a common complaint about voter ID laws, which are struck down in the courts all the time. 1: https://www.justice.gov/file/3835pdf/download

Non-citizens voting is still in person voter fraud. I'm sure it has happened, but it is vanishingly rare, you citation is about 1 person.

There is simply no incentive to commit that crime. Even less so if you're a non-citizen, because if you're caught you'll be deported. Very few people commit crimes where they have nothing to gain, a lot to lose, and a high chance of being caught. It is almost a non-issue.

There is literally no evidence that in person voter fraud poses a threat to the integrity of US elections either local or national. It is a red herring.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I remember the outrage when the original Diebold hacking announcement was made in the Bush Jr era. The concerns in that were never addressed and doubtless things have simply since got worse. If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election, they could bring some of their engineering prowess to bear on defeating systematic voting machine fraud.

> Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election I'm still surprised by the anger for this. For the purposes of the viewer, Google and Facebook are effectively media companies. By that measure, all media companies bias elections heavily during election cycles. This is done both with content and well as paid advertising. But to "make amends" for something sounds as if their influence is either u…

>"But to "make amends" for something sounds as if their influence is either unprecedented or morally wrong."

I think we're too early in Mueller's investigation to definitively be able to say whether their influence was morally or legally wrong, or whether actions of employees/executives of those companies were morally or legally wrong.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#108

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It i…

"A side". Lets call a Republican a Republican. Same for gerrymandering. If you can't win fairly, win at any cost.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#109
post #75
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're gonna have to provide proof of that.

Proof of what? That voting fraud happens? It assuredly happens, as does more generalized election fraud. In my state of Washington there have been confirmed cases of people voting their dead family member's ballot[1]. And in the 2004 Gubernatorial election there were more illegal votes cast than the margin of victory.[2] Or do you mean that parties fight against efforts to make the voting process more trustworthy? Fe…

You own second citation contains the following passage:

>ridges removed the five votes from the final count: four for Rossi and one for Ruth Bennett.[32] No evidence was brought before the court of any of the illegal votes benefitted Gregoire.[32] The final margin of victory for Gregoire over Rossi was 133 votes.[33] Rossi did not appeal to the state Supreme Court[34] and the Washington State Republican party settled the case after paying $15,000 in court costs to the Democrats.[35]

Judge Bridges' ruling was seen as a comprehensive defeat for Rossi. The judge admitted nearly every piece of evidence the Republican Party offered and then wrote a thorough, tough opinion rejecting the Republicans' claims (while criticizing the administration of the election, particularly in King County); Rossi was left with very little legal ground for a successful appeal. After receiving such a negative verdict, Rossi declined to appeal to the State Supreme Court, claiming that the political makeup of the Court would make it impossible for him to win, thereby ending all legal challenges to the election of Gregoire as the Governor of Washington

The plaintiffs, the Washington Republican party wasn't able to provide any evidence that improperly cast ballots disproportionately went to the winner of the election. Additionally the judge noted that many of the "illegal ballots" were simply improperly cast provisional ballots. That means that people casting them weren't trying to commit a crime, they just messed up.

Even in this case, there is no proof of substantial voter fraud deciding an election. Or even proof of substantial voter fraud. In fact the judge found that King County had poorly managed the process, which is not a matter of in person fraud, which again, isn't a real problem in the US.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a feature, not a bug.

That's not really fair. I care about making sure people are able to vote, too. I expressed a concern about election security because I think it's an issue people should give more thought. It's not fair to suggest that means I don't care about the same things you do too.

Except these red herring concerns are the exact same fake concerns that those who are interested in suppressing voters come out with.
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