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Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

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Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#81

Post by ZoeZoeBee »

brian-armstrong wrote: post #39
alistproducer2 wrote: post #26

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It i…

Yeah, I remember the outrage when the original Diebold hacking announcement was made in the Bush Jr era. The concerns in that were never addressed and doubtless things have simply since got worse. If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election, they could bring some of their engineering prowess to bear on defeating systematic voting machine fraud.

>If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election.

Since when has Google wanted to make amends for biasing the election? Aren't we quick to forget Eric Schmidt was all in on attempting to bias the election in the direction he wanted. Timshel/THE GROUNDWORK are and were nothing more than tools for the DNC to manipulate the electorate

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#82

Post by wang_li »

ch4s3 wrote: post #57
wang_li wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't get charged often because there are parties that fight tooth and nail to prevent the implementation of processes that would allow the detection of ineligible voters voting. It is shown in every election cycle that there are cases of voters voting who should not be because of their citizenship or felon status or voting in multiple districts. When you say that only 2 have been charged, why is that relevant?…

> It doesn't get charged often because there are parties that fight tooth and nail to prevent the implementation of processes You're literally fabricating that. Bluntly,you made this up unless you can provide proof to the contrary. There have been numerous studies that have shown that in person voter fraud is basically non-existent in the US. Think about the motivation for a moment. Committing this crime has negligib…

That's not the only form of vote fraud. Non-citizens voting is illegal and happens[1]. Does it happen in massive numbers? No idea, probably not. To what extent, though, does it compare to eligible voters who don't have ID, which is a common complaint about voter ID laws, which are struck down in the courts all the time.

1: https://www.justice.gov/file/3835pdf/download

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#83

Post by s73ver_ »

wang_li wrote: post #75
s73ver_ wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're gonna have to provide proof of that.

Proof of what? That voting fraud happens? It assuredly happens, as does more generalized election fraud. In my state of Washington there have been confirmed cases of people voting their dead family member's ballot[1]. And in the 2004 Gubernatorial election there were more illegal votes cast than the margin of victory.[2] Or do you mean that parties fight against efforts to make the voting process more trustworthy? Fe…

All of it. Proof that it happens on such a scale as to actually be a problem, and proof that those measures you speak of are not just thinly veiled attempts to disenfranchise voters. If you're going to mess with the people's right to vote, you had better have a damn good reason.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#84

Post by vkou »

brian-armstrong wrote: post #39
alistproducer2 wrote: post #26

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It i…

Yeah, I remember the outrage when the original Diebold hacking announcement was made in the Bush Jr era. The concerns in that were never addressed and doubtless things have simply since got worse. If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election, they could bring some of their engineering prowess to bear on defeating systematic voting machine fraud.

Does Fox News bias the election? Should it be required to make amends?

Do you think it has more, or less influence then a 100K spend Facebook ad campaign by Russia?

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#85

Post by lutorm »

CalChris wrote: post #63
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 2016 polling models were pretty good, or at least, as good as they are usually[1]. The problem is, it was a very close race by electoral college standards. Trump ultimately won by 80,000 votes in three states in an election with 136m votes cast[2]. So the 'deciding' votes were just 0.06% of the vote total. I think we can have it both ways. Voter suppression is being done and we have statistical heats in competiti…

It would take a Constitutional Amendment to get rid of the Electoral College. That’s 2/3rd of both houses of Congress and 2/3rds of the State legislatures. Better to call a third Constitutional Convention.

Lawrence Lessig is trying to challenge not the Electoral College directly but the winner-takes-all way of selecting electors in court, arguing that the Bush v Gore precedent of equal protection taking precedent over the states right to run elections as they see fit should apply also to the winne-takes-all selection of electors.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-time-has-come-reform-the-e...

I have no idea what the chances of success are, but it's an interesting argument.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#86

Post by Larrikin »

vkou wrote: post #84
brian-armstrong wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I remember the outrage when the original Diebold hacking announcement was made in the Bush Jr era. The concerns in that were never addressed and doubtless things have simply since got worse. If Google, Facebook et al wanted to make amends for biasing the election, they could bring some of their engineering prowess to bear on defeating systematic voting machine fraud.

Does Fox News bias the election? Should it be required to make amends? Do you think it has more, or less influence then a 100K spend Facebook ad campaign by Russia?

Way less obviously there are laws to help prevent foreign actors from injecting money and influence in to our elections. Which is why there are bipartisan congressional hearings on an unprecedented attack.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#87

Post by [deleted] »

alistproducer2 wrote: post #26

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It i…

[deleted]

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#88

Post by munk-a »

Bud wrote: post #43
munk-a wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an action which legitimately needs to be done. I think the larger issue we need to fix is the partisan entrenchment that lets people justify this being done to further their own agendas. Using targeted disenfranchisement to further your own political goals is quite clearly illegal, we just need to start sending people to jail over it instead of excusing it because the ends justify the means.

This isn't really about "partisan entrenchment"; this is not a bipartisan issue. It's an issue with Republicans. There's no history of any large-scale activity like this from Democrats.

Democrats gerrymander and listen to lobbyists just like republicans, but you're correct that currently this is just an issue of abuse from republicans. Democrats have everything to gain by enfranchising as much people as possible because their voter base is growing faster than the GOP and urban areas tend to have lower turnout and vote more toward Liberals. But if the tables were flipped I'm sure folks would come out saying "We Democrats need to do it for the good of the party!" If you have any doubts look at the behavior of Donna Brazile and Debbie Wasserman Schultz in the last primary election or even the push during the primary that sanders supporters were acting against the good of the party.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#89

Post by vkou »

Larrikin wrote: post #86
vkou wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Fox News bias the election? Should it be required to make amends? Do you think it has more, or less influence then a 100K spend Facebook ad campaign by Russia?

Way less obviously there are laws to help prevent foreign actors from injecting money and influence in to our elections. Which is why there are bipartisan congressional hearings on an unprecedented attack.

I understand that this is illegal. What I don't understand is why domestic manipulation of elections isn't. Eric Schmidt and Rupert Murdoch don't have the interests of the US in mind any more then Putin does.

Just because it's quite precedented doesn't make it right.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#90

Post by wang_li »

fencepost wrote: post #70
wang_li wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't get charged often because there are parties that fight tooth and nail to prevent the implementation of processes that would allow the detection of ineligible voters voting. It is shown in every election cycle that there are cases of voters voting who should not be because of their citizenship or felon status or voting in multiple districts. When you say that only 2 have been charged, why is that relevant?…

You claim that there are a significant number of fraudulent votes happening. The corollary of what you're attesting to is that Kris Kobach and many other folks responsible for enforcement of the laws are utterly and completely incompetent. I don't have time to track down where I did the math, but even being very generous with the claims of fraud (assuming that they're wildly overstating) and assuming that Kansas bein…

> You claim that there are a significant number of fraudulent votes happening.

If you mean "significant" in the sense of large, then no I did not. If you mean "significant" in the sense of meaningful, then I assert that even one illegal vote cast is significant as it disenfranchises a legitimate voter.

One group has found that between 2011 and 2017, 1852 ballots were cast by illegal aliens in Virginia.[1]

1: https://publicinterestlegal.org/blog/report-5500-noncitizens...

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