51–60 of 175 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why not? Let them fork, iterate and improve. They have a strong identity and economy, so they must be doing something right. Maybe being tied to a monolith even hinders their progress? (Just ideas for thought.)
Everyone on Earth has a petty identity. If we allow secession just so every self-identifying group can 'rule' themselves then we encourage those petty identities when we should be discouraging them and instead encouraging universal humanism.
The interesting question is what level of brutality the EU is willing to accept before intervening.
They won't intervene, as it is 'domestic issues'. They are more than happy to turn a blind eye as long as there's nothing physical, since a hypothetical independence would cause instability in the EU and might give the pro-Independence movement more legitimacy.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
That street must be Sesame Street. Seriously now. The catalan goverment is acting illegally, against Spanish and Catalan law. What do you expect? The Spanish government must apply the law.
Exactly my sentiments. What is the point of the constitution if one of the country's region starts disobeying and unilaterally declare independence? These are kind of disobediences which the Spanish government must fight - even if they lose.
It is not immutable, universal or objective, and if it loses the consent of a majority the social contract is broken.
Assuming there's a group of people who more or less agree to be separate from some larger group, it's hard to think of legitimate reasons why they shouldn't be allowed to secede. Their forefathers having signed an agreement is hardly a convincing reason to hold them in a union they no longer like. Neither are issues of the current political situation ("it would destabilize the region..."). There's still hard question…
"The people" includes a lot of people who don't want to separate. If 99% want it I would say OK, maybe. Where does one draw the line? Take a look at how the separation of India and Pakistan went if you want to get an idea of how it might go.
So then you find that all government is illegitimate? or is your 99% requirement only valid for separation?
The central Government is not escalating anything, on the contrary, it has been extremely weak.
Imagine that some State in the US declares the president of the US has no decisions over his land, and that you follow your own local laws(made by you on the go) instead of the laws of your country. It will not take more than 5 minutes of that for the country to act.
The Parlament local laws said that you need two thirds of the Parlament in order to do anything serious. Those guys wanted to declare independence with half the seats plus one. Those seats represent less people that those that were not independentists.
In the case of Spain it has taken almost a month to do something, and most of the responsible people are out there free, earning a very good salary for trying to destroy the country.
In China when revolution won everything that Chinese elite did was bad, even if they did some things well, like having hygienic manners. As a result, living in China today is extremely disgusting.
In Spain the same happens with anything Franco dictatorship did. We always have to do the opposite of what Franco would have done.
So because Franco was nationalist and brave(he risked his life over 200 hundred times in battle) politicians believe that democracy needs to be against the nation and weakness the rule. They do not consider that you could be a democracy and take your country seriously.
So they made it legal for politicians that want to destroy the system be part of the System. They gave territories more autonomy, a local tv, local police, the education and health system.
Local police now is acting like a private independentists police(like the SA and SS were private armies of Hitler against Germany army and police). Local TV and radio uses their airtime to put loop videos of Spanish police "brutality" (nothing compared against last Germany action in the G20 summit or Britain with Brexit protests), where the local police has not followed orders by central Government.
The local health system(following also local orders) declared anyone having an anxiety crisis for watching local TV loops to be an officially "injured" by Spanish police. More than 200 "injured" by Spanish police had just watched TV.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think the US would let California secede.
Sorry maybe it's going above my head. Is this sarcasm or there's some context?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
That street must be Sesame Street. Seriously now. The catalan goverment is acting illegally, against Spanish and Catalan law. What do you expect? The Spanish government must apply the law.
At one time these little colonies in America acted illegally. They wanted representation with their taxation.
>The unexpectedly forceful moves by Mr. Rajoy That’s not true. Catalan leaders were given a few days to make it clear whether they had declared the independence or not, because after their joke referendum, they were intentionally vague about what they were going to do. Puigdemont dodged the question again so this is it. They said they want to negotiate with the central government. In my opinion this is simply rackete…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
That street must be Sesame Street. Seriously now. The catalan goverment is acting illegally, against Spanish and Catalan law. What do you expect? The Spanish government must apply the law.
Exactly my sentiments. What is the point of the constitution if one of the country's region starts disobeying and unilaterally declare independence? These are kind of disobediences which the Spanish government must fight - even if they lose.
People rose against, somewhere peacefully and somewhere violently, it and it is not anymore. Those countries are much better off now.
Constitutions often can be unjust, at time to time they get thrown away/re-rwitten.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly my sentiments. What is the point of the constitution if one of the country's region starts disobeying and unilaterally declare independence? These are kind of disobediences which the Spanish government must fight - even if they lose.
Government, and law, is by consent. It is not immutable, universal or objective, and if it loses the consent of a majority the social contract is broken.
The actions of the Spanish government are supported by right wing (PP), left wing (PSOE), and center wing (Ciudadanos).