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Introducing Surface Book 2

blogs.windows.com

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Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#391

Post by michaeljchou »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #277

Talking about the hardware this is a pretty interesting offering. The got the new 8th gen i7 into the display half (which they failed to do for the new Surface Pro which seems like an odd omission). Seems like a solid follow up to the original Surface Book (which I have). In my experience my Surface book is most usable in 'studio mode' (their name for folded back over the keyboard with the display up) and an external…

> They got the new 8th gen i7 into the display half (which they failed to do for the new Surface Pro which seems like an odd omission).

8th gen intel processors were not out when the new Surface Pro released. And they had to release it because it was long overdue since SP4.

> On the road my 12" Surface Book is a bit too little screen area and so I use my 15" macbook pro 2015 for that. The 15" version of the surface book 2 would be a win there but at 4.2lbs my shoulder will complain. (I briefly had the 4+ pound Sony VAIO and it was painful enough that I just never took it on trips as powerful as it was.)

15"MBP: 4.49lb(2015), 4.02lb(2016&2017)

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#392

Post by wlesieutre »

glhaynes wrote: post #214
wlesieutre wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a tradeoff. The old SP1s and SP2s with Wacom digitizers get funky at the edges because of how Wacom's technology works. IIRC it's a big array of sensors behind the screen, and they have to extend past the edges of the sensing area to keep accuracy workable across the surface. If you're out at the edge of the grid it can't measure the pen's position accurately. With Wacom's Intuos tablets you've probably noticed…

Does the iPad Pro work similarly to either of those?

I didn't bother with as extensive a test back when I doodled this, but it's much better: http://i.imgur.com/kdgwbR7.png

You can see some slight vertical jogs, but nothing to the degree of what the Surface has. I've never noticed it in actual use on the iPad. On my SP3 I definitely did.

I don't actually know how the technology in Apple's Pencil works compared to Wacom and ntrig, but my assumption is that it's more similar to ntrig with having the detection hardware up front in the display/glass assembly instead of behind it. It uses an active stylus w/ battery (similar to ntrig), while Wacom's stylus is a passive batteryless device.

In terms of accuracy, iPad and Wacom seemed similar to me. Never used a Cintiq (just the screenless pads) so I can't make a fair comparison. I've heard that the Cintiq has more visible lag with your stroke catching up to the pen, but that's much harder to notice when you're drawing on your desk while watching a separate screen.

The iPad is my favorite, hands down. It feels very natural to use.

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#393

Post by alphonsegaston »

omikun wrote: post #332
alphonsegaston wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The iPad Pro is better than the Surface in terms of the digitizer, but not as good as Wacom.

Where did you hear this? From my personal experience and watching some youtube reviews from concept artists/illustrators, the Pencil beats Wacom hands down.

I’m an illustrator, have an iPad Pro and a high-end Wacom. Work with a lot of people in the animation industry. No one is regularly using iPads for anything besides sketching/toying with ideas.

If Apple made a big push to improve their hardware, get full blown Photoshop with Adobe’s brush engine, this could conceivably change. Everything’s too piecemeal right now though. File management is still terrible, Photoshop brushes are only available in Adobe’s terrible apps, lots of Bluetooth buginess from app to app, inconsistent UI patterns etc. The newest Procreate update and Affinity designer are pretty cool, but it’s still not there yet.

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#394

Post by mmcconnell1618 »

baldfat wrote: post #369
robotresearcher wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Macs have supported right click out of the box for many years.

With the Mac Mouse having a right click? No you buy an official apple mouse you have single click options only. Also the laptops are also single click.

This is incorrect. Both Apple laptops and mice support right-click out of the box. You can configure it from the System Settings -> Mouse / Trackpad.

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#395

Post by [deleted] »

kanishkdudeja wrote: post #8

The i5 variant comes with just 8 GB RAM. Would have considered if they had given an option for 16 GB RAM. Being a developer, 8 GB seems tight these days! 15-inch 16 GB variant comes with i7 but the price is a little too steep (starts from 2500 USD)

[deleted]

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#396

Post by millstone »

MikusR wrote: post #100
mbell wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems to depend on the task. The highest end CPU available, even the 15", is the i7-8650U which is a 1.9Ghz @ 15W part. This is also how they pull off 17hr battery life, they are putting an ultrabook processor in a 15" laptop. Current 15" MBP can be had with a i7-7920HQ, 3.1Ghz @ 45W which I would expect to be quite a bit faster for multi-core workloads.

Which they run at 20W

This doesn't appear to be true. I tested my i7-6920HQ MBP with Intel Power Gadget and it reports 45-46 watts under load when on AC power, and 40 watts on battery. Reported speed is 3.1 GHz (official specs are 2.9).

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#397

Post by binarycrusader »

alphonsegaston wrote: post #193
binarycrusader wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, with a 3:2 aspect ratio touch screen and WACOM-level stylus input (via ntrig).

Most creative professionals would disagree that ntrig is anywhere near parity. I work in the field and everyone uses Wacoms of some sort. There was initial excitement when the 1st generation launched with actual Wacom technology, as a lot of us do work in Windows, but it quickly fizzled when Microsoft cheaped out and went with less performant ntrig digitizers.

I didn't say WACOM equivalent; I said WACOM-level.

Whether or not it is equivalent is a subjective judgement on the part of the user.

Personally, the current stylus input supported by ntrig is sufficient for my particular needs.

The ntrig technology Microsoft acquired has been significantly improved since its first implementation, so I think your judgements are perhaps somewhat obsolete?

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#398

Post by Crespyl »

olyjohn wrote: post #388
scholia wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(1) Superfish isn't a Chinese company -- it was founded in Tel Aviv and moved to Palo Alto; (2) Superfish wasn't installed on ThinkPads; (3) it wasn't on Lenovo laptops for long: they uninstalled it and apologised.

The fact that they did it in the first place is enough for most people. An apology hardly covers the potential for damage. All in the name of some bundled shitware to make them a few extra bucks. Totally inexcusable, and I don't see why people jump in to defend them at all.

Yeah, I wish I could like them, since Lenovo/Thinkpad has been putting out some pretty appealing hardware recently, but that kind of irresponsible behavior demands a response from people who understand the severity.

I refuse to buy or recommend Lenovo for my family members for at least another three years yet, no matter how much they seem to have reformed. If they haven't had a repeat incident in that time I'll be glad to start considering them again.

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#399

Post by noir_lord »

rdslw wrote: post #346
jozzz wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's pretty much the exact T470p config I was thinking of getting. I will probably rarely use the keyboard/trackpad except when travelling (not often) as most days I plan to use an usb mechanical keyboard+mouse. So all I'm really bothered about is whether I get better value for money in terms of CPU and screen with the XPS compared with a thinkpad. Of course the XPS is prettier as well ;) I've read the XPS screen i…

Dont. I curse the day ive chosen 13” xps with 3200x1800 hdpi screen. Id trade it for fullhd in a blink. Three issues: 1. It is goddamn mirror, and mind you im not picky here 2. Hundreds of apps or system parts (regedit? Wtf?) are complettly messed up by hdpi and scaling leaves you either too small or problems. Keybase desktop client (search for my bug) shows what you can expect. Windows 10 can not handle it. Gnome wo…

2560x1440@14" is perfect under Cinnamon/Fedora@192dpi, there is one application that causes me problems but everything else just works.

Re: Introducing Surface Book 2

#400

Post by WorldMaker »

jamesgeck0 wrote: post #357
demonshreder wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft: Gaming has been a first class citizen at Microsoft for a while and I'm not sure if we can say the same about Apple. This is changing fast if not changed already. Xbox One, DX12 lock in on Universal Windows Platform and finally, > Windows 10 also has a "Gaming Mode" as part of the OS for performance improvement which some games might have it turned on automatically. https://www.vg247.com/2016/10/14/dota-2…

You don't have to use UWP to use DX12, and you don't have to use DX12 in Windows Store games. DX12 does require WDDM 2, but that's a different bucket of worms. Xbox Game DVR predates Game Mode; you can enable/disable them independently.

Also, you don't even have to use the Windows Store to install UWP games. Windows 10 allows sideloading by default (since the November Update two years ago, though shortly after Valve made their stink) and since the Anniversary Update (1611) last year this time, there is a nice little installer that pops up if you double click a (signed) UWP APPX package.

So even if DX12 was restricted to UWP apps (which, reminder, it isn't) UWP apps are not restricted to the Store either, and Steam could install UWP apps, too.

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