New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior • Hacker News Board

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#351

Post by matchbok » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 1:53 AM UTC

stretchwithme wrote: post #234

mrbabbage wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We also need competition in bus service, not government-run, subsidized monopolies. Then we'd see many more transportation options. No local transportation system in America covers its operating costs using fare revenue. Most local bus agencies in America only cover about 20% of opex with fares; the best agencies (e.g. BART) might get to 70%. This doesn't even consider capital costs. Good luck getting a private ent…

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-mitchell-jitneys-...

Please present an argument, not a link. This is hacker news, not reddit.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#352

Post by raiyu » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:00 AM UTC

This study is definitely flawed and should differentiate between hyper dense cities like NYC and other major metro areas.

In the first graph they ask people what they would do if Uber/Lyft wasn't available and only 1% responded they would use a taxi.

This is completely untrue. Being a New Yorker for 25+ years, and completely switching my commute preferences for Lyft/Uber I would certainly use Taxi's much more frequently if there were no ride-hailing services available.

Can't believe that 99% of occurrences would do something other than use a taxi.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#353

Post by zjarek_s » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:00 AM UTC

ekianjo wrote: post #344

netsharc wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They should've done this study in a European city with great public transport which also has Uber, like Munich or Berlin.

"Great public transport" means what exactly? Even in Japan which is widely recognized as one of the countries with excellent public transport, trains and buses stop at night (and not too late either), so if you are going out, and coming back after midnight it's either your car or a very expensive taxi. Is Munich/Berlin any different?

Probably. It is common for european subway to be open on weekends. In my city (Warsaw) subway during fri/sat and sat/sun nights goes every 15 minutes. Night buses start every 30 minutes from central station in every direction, with exception of more remote destinations which have bus every hour. However if you live out of the city and commute by train you are probably out of luck between 1am and 5am.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#354

Post by SilasX » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:04 AM UTC

smsm42 wrote: post #101

justboxing wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> expand routes, increase availability, update their equipment. ... and be faster . The SFMTA in San Francisco , at an average travel speed of 5 miles / hour. Is only slightly faster than brisk walking. Also, from the downtown FiDi out 2 miles in every direction, the Bus has a bus stop at Every block. Yes, every block.

This is a basic contradiction which I am not sure is solvable. If the stops are too far away, you (or somebody for whom walking is harder, like older people, less physically fit people, etc.) won't be able to use it. If stops are too close, getting through them takes a lot of time. I know there is a body of work that tries to find optimal setup for such cases, but I'm not sure it's possible to make everybody happy he…

Yes, there is a tradeoff to more vs fewer stops. A stop at each small city block is still too far in the fewer direction: very few lost riders, very slow effective speed.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#355

Post by curun1r » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:05 AM UTC

gcr113 wrote: post #329

FullMtlAlcoholc wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood that about BART. Why were its hours never extended? It seems like that'd be a sure thing to pass if it makes even a small impact on driving fatalities. I doubt that the taxi union had sway over this?

BART does not have duplicate tracks, unlike the transit systems in most other major metropolitan areas. The few hours that it stops overnight are required for maintenance. It's basically not an option for BART to run 24/7.

24/7 isn't required. Since last call is at 2am, running until 3am on Sat and Sun would make a huge difference and cost them 5 hrs of maintenance time. That's probably still a problem, but it seems like a solvable one.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#356

Post by danans » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:13 AM UTC

jdavis703 wrote: post #300

noobermin wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the answer is city and state governments need to get serious about public transit. Every other major countries' cities invest in their public transit, it's just the city governments here in the US treat it like any public service, a barebones skeleton of a safety net for the poor that politicians target for cuts.

The median Caltrain rider makes $129,000 [0]. Unless a six figure income is considered poor, there's no way this is a safety net for the poor. 0: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://...

You are right that Caltrain isn't a good example, but the bus transit systems of the Bay Area's suburban locales, like SamTrans, do reflect the GP's comment. SamTrans' 2011 median rider income was $36000, 64% had no car, and 33% were youths.

http://www.samtrans.com/Assets/_SSP/archives/2011/July_Open_...

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#357

Post by danans » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:20 AM UTC

colechristensen wrote: post #177

bdcravens wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't mass transit generally planned for those without vehicles?

I calculate a different way. Right now it's $322 to fly SFO to JFK for a trip of 5172 miles that's 3.1¢/mile. Compare a $8.25 trip Mountain view to San Francisco round trip at 20.6 ¢/mile. Are trains so inefficient that it's cheaper to fly than to ride? Excuse me while I create a commuter airline between cities in the bay area.

The main cost difference between trains and airplanes is the staffing required X hours. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwjwePe-HmA

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#358

Post by TrinaryWorksToo » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:28 AM UTC

abalone wrote: post #168

ibejoeb wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That all seems like a net positive to me, especially in major urban areas that a very car dependent like Los Angles, Atlanta, Houston... In LA, driving drunk was just the way of life, and it was a real problem. Now, I don't know anyone who prefers driving over ridesharing given the option. Uber Pool makes getting from the east side to the west side faster that public transit for about $10-15, which is less than 1 dri…

I don't think the study is "faulting" anyone. Clearly ridesharing is a very popular and convenient alternative to driving and public transit which are both rife with problems. It is however contributing to traffic and emissions. Those are important facts to establish because previously it was thought that maybe ridesharing is helping with those too, like a dream come true. It concludes, "substantial policy action may…

If we want ridesharing to decrease emissions and traffic, someone should subsidize it as first and last mile transit. That way cars are always at capacity (always picking up or dropping off users) and traffic gets reduced on highways (people will be on transit).

In addition public transit will fill to capacity, allowing them to run more often.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#359

Post by shiftpgdn » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:43 AM UTC

austenallred wrote: post #77

justboxing wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> expand routes, increase availability, update their equipment. ... and be faster . The SFMTA in San Francisco , at an average travel speed of 5 miles / hour. Is only slightly faster than brisk walking. Also, from the downtown FiDi out 2 miles in every direction, the Bus has a bus stop at Every block. Yes, every block.

For San Francisco I’d settle with “not smell of feces/vomit so badly you can’t stomach riding in the first place.”

That's the barrier for riding public transit in much of the country to be honest. I'd be happy to take the local light rain or commuter busses with my kids but the fact they're usually used as toilets and air conditioned sleeping areas with wheels for vagrants means I'll be driving. Even if it's less convenient.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#360

Post by diogenescynic » Mon, Oct 16, 2017, 2:44 AM UTC

Because most mass transit in the US is awful. For $3 more, I don't have to deal with people using drugs or defecating on the bus in my vicinity. Honestly, this is a failure on the the public transit cops and administrators for failing to keep stations, trains, and buses clean.